Duke and Duchess of Cambridge?

[sockknitter]

Watching BBC America, the commentator said, tongue-in-cheek, in the unlikely event the really needed a last name, it would properly be "Mountbatten-Windsor". They showed it on the screen, hyphenated.

Not that they are the be all, end all of protocol. But surely they should know more than me?

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

Watching BBC America, the commentator said, tongue-in-cheek, in the unlikely event the really needed a last name, it would properly be "Mountbatten-Windsor". They showed it on the screen, hyphenated.

Not that they are the be all, end all of protocol. But surely they should know more than me?

Quite right; all of the children of the Queen have the same last name from birth: Mountbatten-Windsor, Mountbatten being the last name of their father, HRH Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh.

[McClef]

The original usage of Mountbatten-Windsor was supposed to refer to those descendants of the Queen who do not hold Royal ranks or titles themselves but this has often still been used by those who do! However the royal house is still simply Windsor whether or not individuals like to add the Mountbatten bit themselves.

Well well I never read anywhere before about William IV being double barreled with St Andrews! One lives and learns!

Which of the "aura's" though? The one about Albert Victor being Jack the Ripper or the one about him liking certain establishments that catered for gentlemen of certain tastes? Another Clarence was drowned in a butt of Malmsey wine as I recall from Shakespeare.

A Duchess may use her first name but someone who is not a Princess in their own right derives the title from their husband. Where the husband is a Prince but not a Duke (such as Prince Michael of Kent who is a younger brother of the Duke of Kent but still entitled to the rank of Prince as a grandson of a Sovereign in the male line) then the name of the husband is indeed used following the Princess bit. Where a current Royal Duchess is concerned it is more usual to simply say "The Duchess of X" just as it is more usual to simply say "The Duke of X". Thus we have The Duchess of Cornwall and never Princess Camilla. It is different again with a Queen Consort who will always be entitled to use their own name. It is also the entitlement of the wife of the Heir to the Throne to use their own name as Princess this or that though again usually in this case it would be Princess of Wales.

Whilst Diana was still married to Charles she was referred to as either Princess Diana or The Princess of Wales. She only became "Diana, Princess of Wales" after the divorce which was in some ways weird as she was no longer royal and a non royal Princess is a rare thing!

Coming back to the Kents - the Duchess of Kent has stated that she does not wish to be addressed or referred to as an HRH but her personal wishes have no bearing upon her official title. The new Duke of Cambridge has long simply wished to be called "William" but this could be harder to maintain now.

It's going to be an interesting time for royal etiquette in the future I think!

[Chas]

It is also the entitlement of the wife of the Heir to the Throne to use their own name as Princess this or that though again usually in this case it would be Princess of Wales.

Whilst Diana was still married to Charles she was referred to as either Princess Diana or The Princess of Wales. She only became "Diana, Princess of Wales" after the divorce which was in some ways weird as she was no longer royal and a non royal Princess is a rare thing!

Sorry Trefor, I must disagree. Diana was the wife of the heir to the throne but was never Princess this or that.

Titles and Styles

• 1 July 1961 – 9 June 1975: The Honourable Diana Frances Spencer
• 9 June 1975 – 29 July 1981: The Lady Diana Frances Spencer
• 29 July 1981 – 28 August 1996: Her Royal Highness The Princess of Wales
• 28 August 1996 – 31 August 1997: Diana, Princess of Wales

Posthumously, as in life, she is most popularly referred to as "Princess Diana", a title she never held. Still, she is sometimes referred to (according to the tradition of using maiden names after death) in the media as "Lady Diana Spencer", or simply as "Lady Di".

Diana's full title, while married, was Her Royal Highness The Princess Charles Philip Arthur George, Princess of Wales & Countess of Chester, Duchess of Cornwall, Duchess of Rothesay, Countess of Carrick, Baroness of Renfrew, Lady of the Isles, Princess of Scotland.

Likewise, Charles' current wife.

• 17 July 1947 – 4 July 1973: Miss Camilla Rosemary Shand
• 4 July 1973 – 3 March 1995: Mrs Andrew Parker Bowles
• 3 March 1995 – 9 April 2005: Mrs Camilla Parker Bowles
• 9 April 2005 – : Her Royal Highness The Duchess of Cornwall
  in Scotland: 9 April 2005 – : Her Royal Highness The Duchess of Rothesay

Camilla's style and title in full: Her Royal Highness The Princess Charles Philip Arthur George, Princess of Wales and Countess of Chester, Duchess of Cornwall, Duchess of Rothesay, Countess of Carrick, Baroness of Renfrew, Lady of the Isles, Princess of Scotland.

Regards

Chas

[Mike_Oettle]

Chas wrote: “Many years ago, before Prince William was born, Prince Charles and Diana used Evans, Jones and Powell (all Welsh names) for airlines and hotels. The names were deliberately chosen because they were ‘of Wales’.”

And when Charles and Di first started seeing each other, she told her friends she was dating one Charles Renfrew.
Regards,
Mike

[Chas]

Chas wrote: “Many years ago, before Prince William was born, Prince Charles and Diana used Evans, Jones and Powell (all Welsh names) for airlines and hotels. The names were deliberately chosen because they were ‘of Wales’.”

And when Charles and Di first started seeing each other, she told her friends she was dating one Charles Renfrew.
Regards,
Mike

Thanks Mike - I knew that there was another one. I have been pestering wife about this as she is usually very good on Royal trivia. It is 22:35 and she has gone to bed, I don't know whether I should wake her and put her mind to rest or tell her in the morning...

Regards

Chas

[smacw]

It is likely that the Queen chose Cambridge rather than another of the vacant royal Dukedoms because of her grandmother's (Queen Mary) mother (Mary Adelaide of Teck) being the daughter of a Duke of Cambridge who was a son of George III.

Personally I would have preferred he had been created Duke of Clarence - the last holder of that office also being called William (later King William IV).

I thought Clarence would be the logical choice, but there was later Duke of Clarencethan the later William IV. Oldest Son of the Prince of Wales (later Edward VII) Grandson of Queen Victoria, and 2nd in line for the throne at his birth. Unfortunately he may have added some baggage to the Clarence title before predeceasing both his father and Grandmother.

[Mike_Oettle]

smacw wrote: “It is likely that the Queen chose Cambridge rather than another of the vacant royal Dukedoms because of her grandmother's (Queen Mary) mother (Mary Adelaide of Teck) being the daughter of a Duke of Cambridge who was a son of George III.”

This connection is probably also why Queen Mary’s father, Prince Francis, became Marquess of Cambridge in 1916, having given up his German title Duke of Teck.
Perhaps George V felt unable to make him Duke of Cambridge because Francis was not a British royal, but wanted to keep a link to Mary’s (long deceased) grandfather, Prince Adolphus.
Regards,
Mike

[creagdhubh]

Most interesting thread, thanks for all of the contributing members for quite the intriguing read. I actually did have several questions pertaining to the new title bestowed upon Prince William and Kate Middleton, however, they have definitely been answered. Thank you!

Yours aye,

[Lallans]

Upon bumping into them on the street, I personally should be inclined to use the titles Baron and Baroness Carrickfergus.