"Viking Style" Brouge lacing?

[OC Richard]

Nobody comments on how you tie your necktie...

Oh there's a large amount of commentary on the tying of neckties out there!

Magazine articles and YouTube videos galore. (These are some tie-specific ones, most of the tie commentary is on videos about men's clothing in general.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEA96aV2f6E&t=90s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fU9zLY421Mg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktI_0xZ_x94

[Ivor]

I’m not sure that tying laces up the calves of my legs would be the most comfortable thing and probably leave red welts afterwards so I can see a practical reason why not. So is there actually just this aspect or is it more to do with being the arbiter of all things kilt-related. I did think that Scottish dress was a free form to an extent but then rigid rules and circumspect views seen here seem to contradict this. As a non-wearer this is only confusing but as someone aspiring to it this seems not only confusing but perhaps even threatening.

[Tobus]

I did think that Scottish dress was a free form to an extent but then rigid rules and circumspect views seen here seem to contradict this. As a non-wearer this is only confusing but as someone aspiring to it this seems not only confusing but perhaps even threatening.

This seems to come up often in discussions about wearing all things kilt-related. And I should note that we are having this discussion in the context of the "Putting It On Properly" forum, with the key word being "proper".

This idea that Scottish dress is a "free form" of dress is a bit of a misinterpretation of a well-known quote. It is true, to some extent, that it lacks many of the same rigid conventions as other forms of dress in other cultures. And it is true that there are no kilt police who will detain you for lacing your ghillie brogues too high or wearing the pleats in the front. But there is no form of cultural dress in the world that is free of tradition or norms that made it what it is. Any form of cultural garb will look "right" when worn properly, and "wrong" when not worn properly. Figuring out what constitutes "proper" is, of course, what these discussions are all about. Who determines what is proper? The people who wear it traditionally, having grown up immersed in the culture. There will be a range of opinions to be sure. Some of us seek those opinions, while others may not care.

One can choose to follow their advice to wear it properly. One can also choose to ignore their advice and wear it however they want, but it would be a mistake to think that this would go without some measure of judgment or mild disapproval by those who see it worn foolishly. There is nothing threatening about it, though. The worst one might encounter is a polite correction under the assumption that the wearer simply didn't know he was doing it improperly.

[Father Bill]

It might be more 'proper' to wear the laces where they will function properly than where they will not, but suit yourself.

[Jock Scot]

I’m not sure that tying laces up the calves of my legs would be the most comfortable thing and probably leave red welts afterwards so I can see a practical reason why not. So is there actually just this aspect or is it more to do with being the arbiter of all things kilt-related. I did think that Scottish dress was a free form to an extent but then rigid rules and circumspect views seen here seem to contradict this. As a non-wearer this is only confusing but as someone aspiring to it this seems not only confusing but perhaps even threatening.

You are quite correct there are no rules for Scottish Highland attire. However, there are traditions, conventions, experience, local accepted practice and good taste to consider. If one chooses to ignore those aspects, then carry on and do what you will. I hope you will be happy with the results.

[Ivor]

I can appreciate that formal dress comes with pre-ordained conventions and that these are there to avoid any discomfort at such occasions both for the hosts and guests. I am less sure that these rules, conventions etc. necessarily apply in day to day life, however, particularly nowadays when standards of dress are no longer circumscribed in the way they once were. Obviously certain standards prevail such as those preserving decency and obvious gaffes such as wearing a kilt with the pleats to the front but I am just wondering whether the way one ties laces falls into this category.

[Jock Scot]

When we get down to the minute details for everyday kilt attire, I agree with you. Although, do local people, non pipers, actually wear ghillie brogues with everyday kilt attire? Not in this neck of the woods they dont. It is only when the formality levels rise, by some margin, do the ghillie brogues come out, for some people. Even then they, the ghillie brogue team, would still be in the minority.

[OC Richard]

I did think that Scottish dress was a free form to an extent but then rigid rules...

Did anybody say anything about rules? I know I didn't.

Traditional Highland Dress is a fashion.

Fashions of any sort, punk or biker or office dress or any other, have a number of cultural functions, one of which is to announce to everyone who is a member of that particular "fashion culture" who is also a member, and who isn't.

I work at Disneyland and I see tens of thousands of the General Public every day, and while there's a general "I'm on vacation at Disneyland" fashion one also sees other fashion cultures, announcing where the people are from, what they do for a living, what their income level is, what their hobbies are, what sort of vehicles they get around in, what sort of music they listen to, and so forth.

(We're not blindly guessing, we chat with people and often find out about these things when they're brought up in the course of conversation.)

With Highland Dress as with any other sort of clothing there are ways things are customarily worn, usually stemming from the thing's purpose. If somebody was wearing gloves on their feet and shoes on their hands people might wonder "how can they not know that gloves go on the hands and shoes go on the feet?" You would take that knowledge for granted, wouldn't you?

In like manner in Highland Dress there are ways things are customarily worn, and if people accustomed to wearing Highland Dress see somebody wearing their kilt backwards, or the sporran slung around their neck, or the ghillie laces going all the way up their calves, or the flashes worn on the insides of their legs, they might wonder "how can they not know how to wear that?" They take the knowledge for granted because everyone in their circle of friends and acquaintances knows these things.

"Rules" have nothing to do with it. There's no rule that you must wear gloves on your hands! But you would take notice if you saw somebody walking through the snow with gloves shoved halfway on their feet, the rest bare. You would think "there are things make exactly for that purpose...shoes!" The issue isn't rules, but common sense.

[Tobus]

The issue isn't rules, but common sense.

I agree to some extent, but there are certain parts of Highland dress where common sense doesn't fully explain how to wear the thing without some context. This is why so many people put the pleats to the front. Their "common sense" tells them that it would be reasonable to sit on the flat part and have the swishy bits in front where your knees move. They just don't know any better, and the garment itself doesn't have an obvious front or back if one doesn't know which is which.

With ghillie brogue laces, I suspect that a large part of the issue here is the usual culprit: the kilt hire industry. They seem to take standard/traditional parts of the wardrobe and push them to the extreme. This is how we get flashes dangling halfway to one's ankles, ghillie laces up over the calf, kilts hanging below the knee, and those ridiculous rouche ties. I still haven't figured out whether the hire industry does this on purpose for some sense of "fashion forward" style, or if it's just run by people who can't tell the difference between proper and improper ways of wearing these items. Some part of it may be that these items are made in (and marketed from) places like Pakistan where they don't have the same cultural history of wearing the kilt. We can look at photos of Pakistani pipe bands to see how their way of wearing Highland wear has strayed significantly from Scottish tradition. This is not meant as any sort of slight, but it is clear that wearing the kilt in Pakistan is very much different than how it's worn in the Highlands. Some of this difference may be feeding back into the kilt industry and unintentionally leading people astray.

[Ivor]

Correct me if I’m wrong but my understanding is that the majority of kilt-wearers rely on the kilt hire industry. When I was younger it was necessary to hire a dinner suit(or tuxedo) do attend many functions and the attire provided was accepted without question. Here, however, we have a community who have decided they are above this hire industry and, as a result, hold it in a degree of disdain. Ghillie brogues are no longer to be worn, especially if, horror of horrors, the laces are twined up the legs, white socks are tantamount to a pact with the devil and, heaven forbid ruche ties are a definite no no. Has anyone ever stepped back and wondered whether their dress choices have degenerated into a strictly regimented and confined range of options. Do they stay awake at night wondering if their socks might clash with their kilt or their sporran be unsuitable to wear alongside their belt? I sometimes wonder how young people in Scotland or anywhere else for that matter, would regard the strict guidelines that must be followed here but I think I know the answer to that. They would dress in any way they saw fit.