First Trad Kilt: an ongoing thread

**KiltedCodeWarrior** · 21st October 05, 06:58 AM

I sent this question to Alan in a PM, but thought I would add it to this thread as the answer might help others. I am also making my first kilt, but not documenting it nearly as well as Alan, and have gotten to the point of deciding on the size and number of pleats. I have 33"/84cm of material to work with between the edge of the deep pleat on the left side to the edge of the box pleat on the right. My biggest problem right now is that I had decided on 12 pleats, which is giving me a total pleat size of 7cm. To cover the 22"/56cm around my backend, that works out to 4.6cm reveal with 2.4cm left over for the inner portion of the pleat. This seems like way too shallow a pleat, so I am going back through the numbers again. Seriously thinking about changing to 11 pleats, which gives me 3" for each pleat, but that would mean a reveal of 2" with 1/2" depth for the hidden portion of the pleat. Still a little shallow, but makes it easier to measure and work with. Also means fewer pleats to sew! Any thoughts? Am I going to have do (shudder!) stitch on some more fabric to make this look even half way decent?

**Barb T** · 21st October 05, 07:39 AM

Hi KCW

Kind of depends on what you want your kilt to look like. A typical traditional kilt has 23 to 29 or more pleats with reveals in the range of 3/4"-1" and pleat depths (the hidden part) of 3.5-5". And a traditional kilt typically has on the order of 6 yards in the pleats across the back (that's over 200"!!). So, you can see that having only 33" to work with across the back is a bit of a problem if you want your kilt to look like a trad kilt. A kilt with very wide reveal and a very small depth (1/2" as you've proposed) also won't have any swing.

BTW - are you working with tartan, or plain fabric?

Barb

**KiltedCodeWarrior** · 21st October 05, 09:12 AM

Originally Posted by Barb T.

Hi KCW

Kind of depends on what you want your kilt to look like. A typical traditional kilt has 23 to 29 or more pleats with reveals in the range of 3/4"-1" and pleat depths (the hidden part) of 3.5-5". And a traditional kilt typically has on the order of 6 yards in the pleats across the back (that's over 200"!!). So, you can see that having only 33" to work with across the back is a bit of a problem if you want your kilt to look like a trad kilt. A kilt with very wide reveal and a very small depth (1/2" as you've proposed) also won't have any swing.

BTW - are you working with tartan, or plain fabric?

Barb

Barb, that is what I am fast concluding. I think that I made an initial assumption when buying the material (just over 4 yards remnant, double width) that it would be plenty for a casual "4 yard" kilt, but I was thinking the references to 4-yard, 6-yard, 8-yard kilts meant the total length of the material used in the kilt. But your comment makes me think it refers just to the material in the pleats across the back, correct? Since it was double width, I certainly have enough to cut the other half to length and stitch it together, then hide the seam in a pleat. The material is a plain fabric with a herringbone pattern. I guess I could gain a little material as well but making the first deep pleat a little less deep, but I think I would regret that based on Alan's experience, and I really would not gain much. I am thinking that since I have less than 1 yard for the pleats, I am going to have to stitch the pieces together. Just talking this through, I need to add on a little over 3 yards (3.36 or 121"). That will give me 154" for the pleats. If I make 22 pleats (my hip split is 22", so I am going to make it easy on myself), I can have a 1" reveal and a 3" depth (which takes 6" of material). I think that should give me something that looks fairly nice and has some of the look of a traditional. And before anybody says it, I will stitch on a little extra, say 130" and just trim the under apron of any excess.

BTW, here is a sample of the material:

**Sherry** · 21st October 05, 11:21 AM

Great thread, Alan!

Originally Posted by Alan H

...
OK, allot fifteen minutes to stomping around, cursing and scaring the wife.

...

MORE stomping around and cursing. Much cursing. OK, back to planning stage.

...

Is this included in Barb's book? LOL

Sherry

**Barb T** · 21st October 05, 01:56 PM

Hi KCW

You were actually right the first time that the yardage means total, including the aprons. Because a trad kilt for a man typically has 8 yards, and because you use up about 2 yards in the apron and underapron, that leaves about 6 yards to put into the back of the kilt.

A 4-yard casual kilt for a grown man could probably get away with less than a yard each in the apron and underapron if you didn't want big facings, and that would leave about 2 yards or a bit more for the pleats. So, even with a 4 yard casual kilt, you ought to have at least 72" for the pleats. A dozen big pleats (reveal of an inch and a half or two inches depending on how big the person is) would still let you have a pleat depth of about 3", roughly calculated.

Cheers!

Barb

**HeathBar** · 23rd October 05, 05:13 PM

Alan,

I think this is a great idea for a thread. I recently finished a kilt that was machine sewn. Since then I have bought Barb's book and been studying it off and on as the wife will let me.

I laid mine out on the kitchen bar to pin up the aprons and pin up the pleats. My back was killing me after about an hour. So I'm interested in seeing how it will be sitting down. If I might make one request. When you get to the point of stitching you pleats, could you have your wife take some photos of yourself in the "pleat stitching position"? I'm curious to see what this looks like in action.

Have you already purchased the finishings for this kilt? Did you find them locally or use Barb's suggested retailer's?

I hope I'm not asking too much. Keep up the good work.

**chasem** · 23rd October 05, 06:33 PM

I found it hard to assume the pleating position, for much the same reason that I find kilts more comfortable than pants.

Any suggestions on getting around that?

**KiltedCodeWarrior** · 23rd October 05, 07:24 PM

Originally Posted by chasem

I found it hard to assume the pleating position, for much the same reason that I find kilts more comfortable than pants.

Any suggestions on getting around that?

Chasem, I don't have any suggestions, but I have found the same problem, and compounded by the fact that I am left handed! Which Barb does warn about in her book will be a problem. I understand that the instructions are written to start with the over apron and then work to the left (as worn) around the kilt until finishing the underapron, which I think is smart, as you can then hide any mistakes in the underapron, or sew on a small bit of material if you calculated wrong, but it is certainly a pain for us lefties. And I mean that in a very specific way. I stitched the first pleat on my kilt 2 nights ago and I did not attempt to translate Barb's instructions to a leftie. I measured and then held the pleat tight with my right hand (the portion that fit between my two largest fingers holding fabric tight against where I held the same pleat with thumb and ring finger) and stitched that portion by hand. Then moved my right hand up the fell and started stitching again. By the end of the first pleat, my right hand was in agony and cramping! Needless to say, for this kilt, I will be machine stitching the pleats, measuring them like Barb says still. Luckily my thread is so close a match that they are barely visible, whether machine or hand stitched.

**Alan H** · 23rd October 05, 09:06 PM

I didn't do nuttin' on the kilt this weekend. Instead, I painted a bunch of the interior of the boat with 5x concentration mildew resistant bathroom paint. I've been meaning to do this for 2 years, now it's finally done. I also bought a secondhand space heater and a timer to keep on the boat during the winter.