Great news for modern kilts, MUG's

[sharpdressedscot]

You think they'll get any cheaper?

So more of us broke musicians can afford them!

[jrmiller]

Once Wal-Mart begins selling kilts, they will be cheaper. Probably be made somewhere in Asia for < $1 each, sold to "us" for $20 to $30.

[butch]

We can only hope it will advance the cause but, We might get less then what we expect. It all depends on who will pick up on this news and advance it further. Will it be someone who will only be there in the beginning to get a quick buck or will stay with it and really want to free men from clothing involuntary servitude.

[Strings]

>It must weigh a ton when wet!<

Yes, they do. At least, the denim ones do.

Of course, I haven't worn one water skiing. Wore mine in a dunk tank. Will say that a wet UK on a hot summer day is AWESOME.

Unfortunate side note: hope y'all realize that most dunk tanks have a window at the front of the tank. Use appropriate hand placement!

[JRB]

I noticed there are several good companies not listed in the utility kilt catagory. Alpha Kilts immediately comes to mind. I think that the more companies recognized on the list, the more marketable and mainstream the industry will become.

[The Wizard of BC]

From a Kilt manufacturers side of the story.

The ads in the Outdoor Industry listings are just that, advertisements.
Also note that Freedom Kilts is listed there.
We pay for that exposure. And it ain't cheap.

Earlier this year, many of us in the industry were contacted by the Outdoor Industry website folks, and asked if we would like to advertise on their site.

I thought, "what the heck, it can't hurt to run an ad for a year and see how it goes.".

So far I have had two hits on my website from this listing. Not a very good return for my money so far.

The only way to capitalize on a site like this is to subcontract all the sewing out to someone else and have everything made to pants size.
The reason I probably won't get a lot of business from this ad is because I do custom made Kilts and cannot produce them by the hundreds or thousands like some others.


I find it sort of strange that early in the history of X Marks there was a lot of talk about the mainstreaming of Kilts and how that would bring the price down to the cost of jeans.
Then we had just that sort of business pop up. In the Pakistani Kilt market.
With the access to a labor market that could work for far less than the working wage here in the Western world, and access to fabrics that are able to be produced at a fraction of the cost of Kilt wool, the 50 or so manufacturers in Pakistan are flooding the market with garments at about the cost of jeans.
And what happens, now everyone complains about no custom fit available, fake Tartans, Kilts bursting into flame, and unscrupulous marketing practices.

Yes, a Kilt like garment can be made for the cost of a pair of jeans and sold in WalMart. But what do you get for your $50.00?
Jeans are all made overseas. The quality has been going down steadily for years now. And the standard sizing and fit of jeans has altered men's perception of how to wear clothing.

As an example of the effect of buying a garment that is made to fit a "standard" or "average" shape, by wearing a garment in the manner some designer thinks it should fit, and buying into the advertising slogans, we have men today who have never worn a truly comfortable garment. Who think their waist is down around their hips. Who think stiff Denim is the apex of comfortable. Who have never wrapped a tape measure around themselves and actually think that their size is a 32.

It really is a double-edged sword. You can have inexpensive. But are you willing to give up something else? Something like jobs. Something like a fit that actually is your shape and not that of a mannikin. Fabrics that are woven to the specifications of actual registered Tartans. Fabrics that will last more than a couple of years.

I am not against the mainstreaming of the Kilt. I would love for this garment to become more accepted in the world. But I think I'll stay with doing what I'm doing and leave the mass production to others.

[Geoff Withnell]

From a Kilt manufacturers side of the story.

The ads in the Outdoor Industry listings are just that, advertisements.
Also note that Freedom Kilts is listed there.
We pay for that exposure. And it ain't cheap.

Earlier this year, many of us in the industry were contacted by the Outdoor Industry website folks, and asked if we would like to advertise on their site.

I thought, "what the heck, it can't hurt to run an ad for a year and see how it goes.".

So far I have had two hits on my website from this listing. Not a very good return for my money so far.

The only way to capitalize on a site like this is to subcontract all the sewing out to someone else and have everything made to pants size.
The reason I probably won't get a lot of business from this ad is because I do custom made Kilts and cannot produce them by the hundreds or thousands like some others.


I find it sort of strange that early in the history of X Marks there was a lot of talk about the mainstreaming of Kilts and how that would bring the price down to the cost of jeans.
Then we had just that sort of business pop up. In the Pakistani Kilt market.
With the access to a labor market that could work for far less than the working wage here in the Western world, and access to fabrics that are able to be produced at a fraction of the cost of Kilt wool, the 50 or so manufacturers in Pakistan are flooding the market with garments at about the cost of jeans.
And what happens, now everyone complains about no custom fit available, fake Tartans, Kilts bursting into flame, and unscrupulous marketing practices.

Yes, a Kilt like garment can be made for the cost of a pair of jeans and sold in WalMart. But what do you get for your $50.00?
Jeans are all made overseas. The quality has been going down steadily for years now. And the standard sizing and fit of jeans has altered men's perception of how to wear clothing.

As an example of the effect of buying a garment that is made to fit a "standard" or "average" shape, by wearing a garment in the manner some designer thinks it should fit, and buying into the advertising slogans, we have men today who have never worn a truly comfortable garment. Who think their waist is down around their hips. Who think stiff Denim is the apex of comfortable. Who have never wrapped a tape measure around themselves and actually think that their size is a 32.

It really is a double-edged sword. You can have inexpensive. But are you willing to give up something else? Something like jobs. Something like a fit that actually is your shape and not that of a mannikin. Fabrics that are woven to the specifications of actual registered Tartans. Fabrics that will last more than a couple of years.

I am not against the mainstreaming of the Kilt. I would love for this garment to become more accepted in the world. But I think I'll stay with doing what I'm doing and leave the mass production to others.

Loud Applause! The kilt will probably never be a truly mass marketed item, and if it does become so, it will be in the form of something like the SWK Thrifty. Don't get me wrong, I am not running Jerry down at all, I own and wear several Thrifties. They take the place of the old worn jeans in my wardrobe. They will lead some to wearing better things as they did me. While I am not yet your customer, my money having gone to other quality kiltmakers, I think you have the right idea. Keep up the good work!

Geoff Withnell

[vorpallemur]

Garment production is an area that benefits greatly from economies of scale. If someone could sell as many kilts (or kilt-like garments) as Levi Strauss sells jeans, there's no reason they couldn't make them sized in the four dimensions that matter (waist, hip, waist-hip distance, and length), and at a reasonable price. It's simply a matter of deciding to spend the money to make the patterns, and the machinery to make it practical.

[JRB]

Actually, I find cheap, foreign made, poor quality jeans very comfortable. There's room for high end and for low end in the marketplace. I certainly agree with you, Steve, that you should remain aming the high end. That's what you do and you do it very well. However, I believe that the kilt wearing community can only benefit from the mainstreaming of the garment. Not necessarily because of price (those of us who want custom made kilts are going to pay for them regardless of the rest of the industry) but because of the fact that acceptability of the kilt means the ability for all of us to wear our kilts in any situation without having to start threads with titles like "comments when kilted in public" or "sick of 'the question' every time I go to the pub". Yes, there are those of us that wear our kilts for the comments and looks they garner, or to stand out from the crowd. However, in my opinion, most people want to generally fit in with the rest of societies norms. A widely acceptable kilt would accomplish that.

[The Wizard of BC]

JRB,

You are absolutely right. There is a place for the less expensive, off-the-rack Kilts. I wasn't knocking them.

I just want people to know that the Outdoor Industry website is not a listing of Kiltmakers but an advertisement. The people listed paid for those spaces.

I also want our members to realize that when you ask for the mainstreaming of Kilts and their sale in places like WalMart you have to give up something.

There is a real place in this world for the Pub Style Kilt. And I support those who re-sell them.

As long as they are honest about the product they sell and offer their customers good service.

But quite often what you get in the trade off of inexpensive and mass produced is not always the final answer to the equation.

Jobs gone overseas, companies that are just in it to cash in on profits, shoddy and sometimes dangerous goods, and ill fitting or sloppy looking garments are just some of the other side of the coin.

In the end it will be the consumer that decides what we see in the marketplace. (Well, sometimes it's what the media tells us to wear.)

But these things don't always have to happen. Just look at some of the retailers who advertise on this site. Good quality, fantastic service, and honest dealings on a product that is perfect for what it is sold to be.

And X Marks is leading the way in informed consumers. That's why I love this place so much.