Ruche Cravat with Prince Charlie Outfit

**CMcG** · 23rd July 10, 08:16 AM

IF you should choose to ignore the excellent advice already given and wear a ruche tie, at least try to get a self-tied one. That will allow you to modulate the "over-scrunchiness" that mars the pre-tied ones.

Also, a ruche is the wrong length to go with the short, 3 button waistcoat normally worn with a PC. A cravat looks rather better tucked into a 5 button waistcoat, which leads you to a black Argyll jacket. As far as why one wears a 3 button waistcoat with a PC and a 5 button waistcoat with an Argyll, I believe it has to do with the length of the lapels on the jacket.

The versatile Argyll and 5 button waistcoat (with the dreaded ruche or a standard four-in-hand) would probably be a better choice for an event that starts during the day and extends into the evening anyway...

**artificer** · 23rd July 10, 09:07 AM

Originally Posted by Jock Scot

...
I know you and others might think that I am an outdated fuddy duddy ...

Oh, come on Jock... That's the reason we love you

That and your sage advice on fashion, fishing and Whisky.

**Jock Scot** · 23rd July 10, 09:18 AM

Originally Posted by artificer

Oh, come on Jock... That's the reason we love you

That and your sage advice on fashion, fishing and Whisky.

I reckon at my age there is at least something in my wardrobe that is either "just in",or,"just out " of fashion. Rarely though is it ever "todays" fashion!

**fluter** · 23rd July 10, 07:51 PM

This is it n a nutshell (ditto for Cygnus' succinct account):

Originally Posted by CMcG

Also, a ruche is the wrong length to go with the short, 3 button waistcoat normally worn with a PC. A cravat looks rather better tucked into a 5 button waistcoat, which leads you to a black Argyll jacket. As far as why one wears a 3 button waistcoat with a PC and a 5 button waistcoat with an Argyll, I believe it has to do with the length of the lapels on the jacket.

Just so! Recently I've seen some PC's marketed with the 5-button vest, and photographed with the ruche tie. It just does not look right, to my admittedly foreign-born eye. On the reverse side of the coin, though, the Argyll has been worn successfully with the 3-button PC-style vest, for evening bow-tie usage.

The versatile Argyll and 5 button waistcoat (with the dreaded ruche or a standard four-in-hand) would probably be a better choice for an event that starts during the day and extends into the evening anyway...

or, indeed, with a black bow tie, or a colored bow tie. The black Argyll can do it all.

**hot_rod29** · 27th July 10, 03:10 PM

My meager 2 cents is if you don't like the look of a bow tie, go with a self tying cravat it is more classy than the rouche. From what I've been able to find out a rouche tie is pre-tied, much like the clip on neckties popular while I was growing up.
Given the shortness and width of the cravat you need a 5 button waistcoat to make it look right, otherwise you will be popping out of the top of a 3 button all evening long. And I have noticed the trend of 5 button waistcoats being paired with PC, if you are not "a man of substance" I think the longer vest looks fine... being a model doesn't hurt.

and I know, it is from a kilt hire website.

apparently quick reply doesn't let me post a picture. Google "spirit of bannockburn" and you'll see an example of what I meant.

**Woodsheal** · 27th July 10, 03:21 PM

Is "ruche" pronounced "retch"? If not, it should be...!

**Jordan** · 27th July 10, 05:55 PM

I remember while trying to pick a tie in my local kilt shop last year for Xmas, the lady helping me seemed to think that when wearing a kilt you "Have" to wear a Ruche tie or bowtie if you are wearing a tie! Needless to say she wasn’t best pleased when I down right refused to consider one because they look silly and the only reason I would wear one would be..... Erm nope can’t think of a situation where a proper tie won’t do or a bow tie if all dressed up.

That said for a daytime wedding and going with what I've learned on here I would humbly suggest an argyle or that sort of jacket five button waistcoat tie etc. I know that most people in Scotland who wear a kilt to a wedding don the PC usually because its
A) hired/rented
B) the only thing they have / think they can wear with a kilt except those lacy jacobite things (Which I don’t like either).
So I would give the contrasting advice that if the bride expects you to be in a PC don’t upset her.

I still wouldn’t wear a Ruche tie though but that’s just me and my tuppence

Jordan

**skauwt** · 27th July 10, 06:07 PM

i own a black silk ruche tie and i honestly couldnt give `a monkeys ....what folk think of them

i wear what i want and sucks to anyone who says otherwise ...owning a ruche tie certainly doesn't make me any less scots heck i wear flares most of the time again i couldn't give a monkeys what folk think of those either

its a sad day when a man cant wear what he wants when he wants and why he wants without some ejjit talking down to him
each to there own

(that said though id never wear a ruche with a prince charlie

)

**Cygnus** · 27th July 10, 06:44 PM

Originally Posted by skauwt

its a sad day when a man cant wear what he wants when he wants and why he wants without some ejjit talking down to him

Skauwt,

I don't think anybody is saying that one can't wear whatever one wants. I believe people ask members of the forum what is generally accepted so that they don't look the "ejjit" when they go out.

I, for one, wouldn't talk down to somebody for wearing a ruche tie or a five-button vest with a Prince Charlie coatee, though I might feel a sense of pity or embarrassment for their misunderstanding of traditional dress.

By all means, wear what you like; but if you want to know what others will think of what you're wearing, this is a great place to ask!

**skauwt** · 27th July 10, 07:40 PM

Originally Posted by Cygnus

Skauwt,

I don't think anybody is saying that one can't wear whatever one wants. I believe people ask members of the forum what is generally accepted so that they don't look the "ejjit" when they go out.

I, for one, wouldn't talk down to somebody for wearing a ruche tie or a five-button vest with a Prince Charlie coatee, though I might feel a sense of pity or embarrassment for their misunderstanding of traditional dress.

By all means, wear what you like; but if you want to know what others will think of what you're wearing, this is a great place to ask!

must admit my brothers wedding on saturday i saw a guy wearing a ghille shirt and a argyle jacket and wonderd who told him that it would look good