Seaforth officers' shopping list

[Pleater]

Oh dear - memory is not what it was - I was thinking of a 'heavy'.

I used to have a Navy greatcoat, from a famous surplus store in Portsmouth - half belt at the back, double breasted, worn when trailing through the damp winter weather 1969/70 - probably saved my life as I was used to the dry frosty air half way up a mountain in Yorkshire.

Anne the Pleater

[Brian Rose]

Help a poor colonial out. XX/XX as a price is shillings/pence? Given the salaries listed, I hoping it's not pounds/shillings.
My maternal grandfather left England in 1912. Maternal grandmother in 1915. My go-to rain jacket is ex-Royal Navy. I figured that the R.N. must know something about foul weather.

[Troglodyte]

Help a poor colonial out. XX/XX as a price is shillings/pence? Given the salaries listed, I hoping it's not pounds/shillings.
My maternal grandfather left England in 1912. Maternal grandmother in 1915. My go-to rain jacket is ex-Royal Navy. I figured that the R.N. must know something about foul weather.

Yes, pounds, shillings and pence of the pre-decimalisation (prior to February 1971) sterling, or Lsd as it was known, from Latin librae, soldi, denarii, and the £ symbol is a florid-script capital L.

There were 20 shillings in the pound, and twelve pennies to the shilling, and a price might be shown in shillings only - such as 35/6 instead of £1-15/6, which would be said one pound, fifteen and six. Half-penny and Farthing (quarter-penny) added to the complexity, along with the Guinea of 21 shillings.

Race-horses and barristers are traditionally bought or paid in guineas.

The prices in the list seem ludicrously high compared to army pay, or average earnings for the time. Historians calculate the value of the pound to be approximately £120.00 in today's terms. At the same period, the Pound/USdollar exchange rate was about £1/$4.87.

[OC Richard]

There were 20 shillings in the pound, and twelve pennies to the shilling, and a price might be shown in shillings only - such as 35/6 instead of £1-15/6, which would be said one pound, fifteen and six. Half-penny and Farthing added to the complexity, along with the Guinea of 21 shillings.

And yet, the British conquered a sizable portion of the world.

[Troglodyte]

Oh dear - memory is not what it was - I was thinking of a 'heavy'.

I used to have a Navy greatcoat, from a famous surplus store in Portsmouth - half belt at the back, double breasted, worn when trailing through the damp winter weather 1969/70 - probably saved my life as I was used to the dry frosty air half way up a mountain in Yorkshire.

Anne the Pleater

They were superb..!

For years I had the army 1940 pattern 'dismounted' version that came well below the knees, and no amount of cold or wet ever went through it. And the pockets seemed designed to hold a pint glass - intentional perhaps..?

My nephew now has the coat.

[Tomo]

This list reminded me of another I found in the very good introductory text, ‘The Tommy of the First World War.’ written by Neil R. Storey.

I noticed with interest that the add was from Kendal, Milne & Co.

Kendals is a well-known department store in Manchester. I have been there often.

It was originally opened by a local draper called Watts in 1832, but was soon after bought out by three employees Kendal, Milne & Faulkner. It's know locally just as Kendals and is believed to be the oldest department store in the country. It was bought by Harrods in 1919 and for a time in the 1920's known as Harrods but quickly reverted to Kendal, Milne & Co. due to pressure from both customers and staff. The Harrods Group, including Kendals was then bought by House of Fraser in 1959, but they kept the Kendals name until rebranding in 2005. Despite the name change and extensive re-furbishment, "Kendal, Milne & Co." can still been seen in the marble over the store entrances and most locals still call it Kendals.

The purpose-built 1930's Art Deco building is currently the largest department store in Manchester.

For now it is still trading. It had been scheduled to close early in 2019, due to House of Fraser's financial position. Despite a reprieve more recent plans announced at the end of 2020 suggested it will still close and the building will be refurbished, extended and repurposed as offices. The plans were approved this summer.

[Pleater]

The 'British Warm' or 'British Warmer' in the lists of requirements is a ribbed jersey, I believe.

Anne the Pleater

[Bruce Scott]

The 'British Warm' or 'British Warmer' in the lists of requirements is a ribbed jersey, I believe.

Anne the Pleater

It's an overcoat, worn by officers in preference to the greatcoat.




And still worn by officers of the British Army according this entry in the Army Dress Regulations (All Ranks):

01.127. BRITISH WARM: a pattern of officer’s optional informal overcoat, evolved from a
pea-jacket, and fitted with leather buttons, this later largely displaced the formal khaki greatcoat. The
colour came to be mainly the alternative fawn shade. Not normally a parade item.

[Troglodyte]

The 'British Warm' or 'British Warmer' in the lists of requirements is a ribbed jersey, I believe.

Anne the Pleater

It could be, but in this case it will refer to the style of short greatcoat worn by officers - double-breasted, epauletted, deep collared, of the sort much favoured by retired colonels in port-war films.

Well-made originals are highly prized these days, being much less 'army surplus' in style than the reguar greatcoat.

[Pleater]

Wondering how to post at correct orientation - did a copy onto my PC, then opened it rotated and saved, and it has come back correctly