Pocket Watches with PC

[Troglodyte]

What kind of Jacket is with the double breasted Tartan waistcoat. I’m quite taken with the pairing

It's a rather nice bespoke-made regulation doublet c1930s-40s, with the buttons leaning out from the centre.

The second is another c1960s regulation doublet, but with the bottons in line with the front edges, which gives the impression the line of the buttons leans in to the centre. It has borrowed the waistcoat from the Prince Charlie to have its picture taken. This one also has an unusual breat welted pocket (like an English evening tail-coat) and has additional ticket-pockets hidden under the 'tashes'.

Neither regulation doublet has its own matchng waistcoat, as white, coloured or tartan, or none was the usual way with them.

Bottom picture is Prince Charlie and waistcoat as normal. The PC has hidden pockets in the 'tails' at the back (like the above-mentioned tail-coats had) which was where opera-programmes and dance-cards used to get carried to keep the hands free.

[piperalpha]

It's a rather nice bespoke-made regulation doublet c1930s-40s, with the buttons leaning out from the centre.

The second is another c1960s regulation doublet, but with the bottons in line with the front edges, which gives the impression the line of the buttons leans in to the centre. It has borrowed the waistcoat from the Prince Charlie to have its picture taken. This one also has an unusual breat welted pocket (like an English evening tail-coat) and has additional ticket-pockets hidden under the 'tashes'.

Neither regulation doublet has its own matchng waistcoat, as white, coloured or tartan, or none was the usual way with them.

Bottom picture is Prince Charlie and waistcoat as normal. The PC has hidden pockets in the 'tails' at the back (like the above-mentioned tail-coats had) which was where opera-programmes and dance-cards used to get carried to keep the hands free.

Would you have a photo of the waist coat? I’m going to have a few yards of Tartan leftover from my new kilt.

[Troglodyte]

Would you have a photo of the waist coat? I’m going to have a few yards of Tartan leftover from my new kilt.

Using the excess material from your kilt is the best way to get a matching waistcoat. Nothing removes the difficulties of matching tones, shades, colours, cloth-weight, etc, in quite the same way.

You also have additional options with a matching bespoke-made waistcoat. Length in body, number of buttons, pockets, style of lapels and the like are all open to you own personal choice - even having the back made in the same material, which can be a good option if warmth is a consideration, or if you in the habit of taking off your jacket and you don't want to appear 'undressed'.

Like looking at you watch, there are rules about removing your jacket in the presence of ladies - strictly speaking, a waistcoat is underwear, and taking off your jacket is akin to taking off your shoes in company.

Matching the sett as it gets displayed on the front aprons of the kilt is one option that appeals to many, so that the tartan is used vertically in the waistcoat, and follows on directly from the kilt. But this removes the contrast between the two garments, which is why so many men prefer a bias-cut on the diagonal. Some setts can be arranged to form quite decorative patterns in this way. Accurate pattern-matching is crucial, as the slightest error becomes strikingly obvious.

You will need to allow half a yard of double-width material for a waistcoat, more if you want the back in self-material, too, and sufficient for lapels, pocket welts, flaps, etc.

My recommendation would be to get a selection of pictures showing style elements you fancy, and take them to your tailor for his advice and guidance. And remember to wear your kilt when being measured, as you want to avoid it being too long and coming below the bottom of the jacket. Many tailors will try to use their own 'standard' pattern (which is designed to go with trousers) so be prepared to be strict and stand your ground..!

Alternatively, you can opt for something like this - https://www.houseofbruar.com/m-db-pl...ed-red-38-red/ which is the same flat-bottom style of mine in the pictures, and not a bad price, either. Bespoke would be about three times the amount in my experience.

[piperalpha]

Troglodyte,

Thank you kindly. That was a great learning experience. I’m not so familiar with the rules of society as I’ve typically been around other pipers when I’m in a kilt. I’m never disappointed with the members of forum’s willingness to share what they know.

I plan on having two vests made. One on the bias with the extra material I have from my kilt and another made with black watch Tartan. The contrast between the two Tartans in you photos is striking to me.
I’m lucky that my kilt maker is my mum. I was talking about sending the leftover material away to have a vest made. She said she could make me one if I brought my vest over. All I’ll have to buy is the buttons.

I’ll likely get the second one made when I go to Scotland. I’m going to have a bespoke jacket made by Campbells of Beauly. They can measure me for the waistcoat at the same time.

It time to keep an eye out for an old pocket watch and chain or two.

[Guiness gets my Irish up]

This is the watch that I wear for dress/formal occasions. I completely understand the notion that wearing a timepiece to a formal event is a no-no, but as a former law enforcement officer I cannot bring myself to be without a watch even for short periods of time. It's a vintage Skagen with a Swiss movement that my wife gave to me one Christmas. It has a cover like a pocket watch that covers the watch face.
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[Troglodyte]

As with wrist-watches, pocket watches come in various styles and levels of formality.

Whether your pocket-watch is plated, solid silver or gold is a matter of taste and budget, but evening watches are generally finer quality and size - that is, thinner or flatter so as not to bulk out the pockets of the waistcoat.

It naturally follows that eveneing watch chains are also finer in the same way.

If you are lucky enough to have a minute-repeater in a solid gold hunter-case - an incredible exercise in the skill and craftsmanship of watchmakers - everyne is going to be envious, even if their own evening watches are thinner and more delicate. Most of the time, only the chain can be seen so keeping a small selection for different uses was the normal practice at one time.

These could be a metal clasp and T-bar attached to a leather strap for hanging from the lapel button-hole so the watch can be carried in the breast pocket of the jacket, an all-metal chain for hooking to the waistcoat buttons in some way, and a fancy chain (not unlike a necklace chain) that you could use for smarter evening events.

Very few, even at the very highest levels of society, lead the kind of life where such choices are even a consideration, and most pocket-watches for normal civilian use would fit the bill. The likes of eBay is probably the best lace to find somwthing to suit.

Wonderful though they are in their way, I would recommend avoiding the large, chunky 'railroad' watches which keep time excellently.

Most pocket-watches fall into a 'standard' size, and the movement can be judged by the number of jewels, or rubis, they are built with. A 17-jewel movement in a solid gold case is going to be better quality than a 7-jewel, gold-plated version of the same watch by the same maker.

But as even the cheapest mechanical watches will keep good time - to within a few seconds a week - if kept properly wound, all pocket-watches are worth considering. It is your own budget and personal taste that will be the deciding factors.

[PiperPadre]

I'm certainly leaning towards keeping my watch discreetly tucked into a pocket and not showing off the chain. Personally I don't mind the look of a nice chain, but at the wedding I was in wearing PC I kept a watch with fob tucked into my waistcoat pocket and not showing. In that case I needed a watch as the best man, if only to confirm how late things were running while we waited to be called for the start!

Agreed. There are discreet ways to wear and use it. I only use pocket watches - and for varied reasons. The wrist band or watch, no matter the material, always ends up creating a bad reaction on my skin. Also, I don't like to look at my phone more than necessary and therefore don't want it to be my watch.

I always need a watch for my solo pipe competition times and use it liberally with with my tweed waistcoat.

[CameronCat]

>> ...No watch with evening clothes rule is an entirely new one to me...

-- As it is to me. Although I have no horse in this race, I wonder if, by extension, "society" has decreed that
cell phones (mobiles) are not to be present when wearing formal attire.

[piperalpha]

>> ...No watch with evening clothes rule is an entirely new one to me...

-- As it is to me. Although I have no horse in this race, I wonder if, by extension, "society" has decreed that
cell phones (mobiles) are not to be present when wearing formal attire.

I recently purchased an antique sporran with very little storage. I‘m happy to say my mobile will no longer be on my person while in highland attire.

[PiperPadre]

I recently purchased an antique sporran with very little storage. I‘m happy to say my mobile will no longer be on my person while in highland attire.

A fortuitous result! Bravo.