Clan Chiefs Pleating Preferences

[Jock Scot]

Doesn't Struan Robertson have a chief's kilt with a white stripe added to Robertson red?

I did not know that,thank you. Any more?

[raibeart_dubh]

I did not know that,thank you. Any more?

It looks like MacNab may have one as well:

http://www.macnabclanuk.org/tartan.html

[Bruce Scott]

I know Buccleuch (Chief of the Scotts) has "his own" tartan as well, separate from the Scott tartans. Don't know if it's reserved to his family or is available to all Buccleuch's.

Does Buccleuch come up as a surname? I have heard of Buckalew and Bucklew and understand that these are English, and variations of Buckley.

[EagleJCS]

Does Buccleuch come up as a surname? I have heard of Buckalew and Bucklew and understand that these are English, and variations of Buckley.

From what I've been told by members of the Clan Scott Society, Buccleuch (and its variations) is a surname related to the Clan, and was often used as a substitute for Scott (as was Harden, Balwearie, and other related Scott families: "Scott of Harden", "Scott of Balwearie", etc.). Known variations are as follows: Buckloo, Buckalew, Buckelew,Buckellew, Bucklew. (There are probably others, due to phonetic spellings/changes in literacy over the years).

There's a fella on Linked In that's using Scott-Buccleuch' as his last name.

Also, the current Chief of Clan Scott, His Grace the Duke of Buccleuch and Queensberry, has apparently elected - I don't know for certain, it hasn't been announced to the Society - to use the Buccleuch title as his family name (i.e. Richard Buccleuch). The late Duke preferred 'Scott' as his family name, although he was also known as 'Johnny Dalkeith', as Lord Dalkeith was his courtesy title until his father passed away.

<back to your original thread>

[JSFMACLJR]

his[/I] father passed away.

It is usual--and the law--that peers of the Realm sign their name with the title only; hence the Duke would sign his name simply as "Buccleuch." I doubt very much that the late Duke of Buccleuch signed anything "Scott" or "Dalkeith," except the latter when he had not inherited and went by the courtesy title of the Earl of Dalkeith. The "family name" is Scott.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

I believe that the law regarding names and signatures has been amended, or perhaps superseded is a better term, and it is now lawful in the United Kingdom for one to sign their name in any manner they please.

That bit of trivia aside, many peers continue to use their courtesy title after they accede to the superior title, simply to avoid social/official confusion. Virtually all peers use their title as their "last name"-- Merlin Erroll, for example, who's family name is Hay-- so His Grace is merely following social custom when he introduces himself as "Richard Buccleuth".

[Ryan Ross]

Sounds like another myth to me, though I wouldn't be surprised if someone somewhere could dig up an instance of a chief who wished his personal version of the tartan to be a different set size. Most myths have a kernal of truth to them, but I have never personally encountered such a case.

The first thing that popped to my mind, after reading your post, was that kilt that the MacGregor sometimes wears.

Remember the one? Rob Roy tartan("Mac Gregor Red&Black"), with squares that are 2 or so inches to a side.

[Bruce Scott]

It is usual--and the law--that peers of the Realm sign their name with the title only; hence the Duke would sign his name simply as "Buccleuch." I doubt very much that the late Duke of Buccleuch signed anything "Scott" or "Dalkeith," except the latter when he had not inherited and went by the courtesy title of the Earl of Dalkeith. The "family name" is Scott.

Yes, I'm sure that is the case. The Family's surname is Montagu Douglas Scott without hyphens.

The late Duke wore a tie in the Buccleuch tartan at the Border Gathering in 2000. I don't know if he was given to wearing kilts.......and he was confined to a wheel chair.

[EagleJCS]

It is usual--and the law--that peers of the Realm sign their name with the title only; hence the Duke would sign his name simply as "Buccleuch." I doubt very much that the late Duke of Buccleuch signed anything "Scott" or "Dalkeith," except the latter when he had not inherited and went by the courtesy title of the Earl of Dalkeith. The "family name" is Scott.

Sorry to go off topic again, folks... just putting out information in case this ever gets referenced again.

Actually, according to His Grace (and as Bruce Scott has noted), the family name is 'Montagu Douglas Scott', no hyphens. (Per a letter to the Clan Scott Society, published in the Stag & Thistle quarterly newsletter, Oct/Nov/Dec 2008). According to His Grace, that's what was on their family passports until relatively recently. In his letter, he said his children tend to use the dominant 'Scott' on a day-to-day basis. (His heir is probably still getting used to being Earl of Dalkeith now.)

The late Duke once stated (I don't recall where I read/heard that) that he preferred to use simply 'Scott' when being listed by name and title, e.g. "Walter Francis John Scott, Duke of Buccleuch and Queensberry". He did indeed sign letters and other messages simply as Buccleuch, as is the custom for peers of his station.

As MoR points out, the current Duke appears to be using the modern social custom. 'Richard Buccleuch' is how His Grace signed the forementioned letter.