Tartans other than your family?

[Jock Scot]

Pretty well spot on there Jeff, although there are some in the Highlands that wear the kilt on a more regular basis. Oh and I doubt that there are many shirts worn with the kilt(or anything else)with button down collars, unless they are visitors!

I doubt that many civilian Highlanders would wear the kilt in London(apart from the Tartan Army) as many up here still think that the kilt should only be worn in Scotland and a large proportion of those will consider wearing the kilt below Perth(Scotland) as too far South!

[seanachie]

I doubt that many civilian Highlanders would wear the kilt in London(apart from the Tartan Army) as many up here still think that the kilt should only be worn in Scotland and a large proportion of those will consider wearing the kilt below Perth(Scotland) as too far South!

I am curious Jock, and truly ask this in the interogative. I had read that the Highlands has experienced a migrationof people, particularly younger ones and that the government was wanting to bolster the population. (I would cite the article but don't have it in front of me). Now if Kilts became popular well beyond Scotland and demand grew, this could lead to economic benefit for the region in terms of increased commerce. But if the pervasive mentality was anyone living below Perth should not wear a kilt, that would likely be hard to gain mindshare. So would most people be indifferent to the idea or is there such an attachment to a piece of culture to be preserved that the idea would be rejected? The comments about not wearing a a handsewn 16 oz 8 yard knife pleated kilt for daily wear make total sense. I own only one wool kilt, but other than work I wear the kilt all the time. I just wear PV or in certain circumstances a non traditional kilt. I am not a person of means, and hope this does not sound like extravagance.

[Jock Scot]

I am curious Jock, and truly ask this in the interogative. I had read that the Highlands has experienced a migrationof people, particularly younger ones and that the government was wanting to bolster the population. (I would cite the article but don't have it in front of me). Now if Kilts became popular well beyond Scotland and demand grew, this could lead to economic benefit for the region in terms of increased commerce. But if the pervasive mentality was anyone living below Perth should not wear a kilt, that would likely be hard to gain mindshare. So would most people be indifferent to the idea or is there such an attachment to a piece of culture to be preserved that the idea would be rejected? The comments about not wearing a a handsewn 16 oz 8 yard knife pleated kilt for daily wear make total sense. I own only one wool kilt, but other than work I wear the kilt all the time. I just wear PV or in certain circumstances a non traditional kilt. I am not a person of means, and hope this does not sound like extravagance.

Good question and I have almost been at a loss how to answer it without sounding too gloomy, "dog in the manger" and bitter. I am, I think, a realist though and change does and must come to us all whether we like it or not. Whilst I remember in this fog of a reply---- even today most Highland Scots do not know that PV kilts exist and even if they did their goal would be the traditional 8 yard wool kilt and anything else would not do. Pride would most certainly be an issue here.


Yes you are quite correct the Scottish Government in recent years have tried to swell the population of the Highlands, how that plan is progressing I don't know, but I suspect that they have not stemmed the flow of true Highlanders away from their cultural home. The incomers whilst meaning no harm to the Highlands inevitably dilute the Highland way of life by not understanding the Highlands. It is happening the world over in places, so Scotland is not alone in this. Except that it has been going on in the Highlands for many centuries. Why? OK we have greed,famine,wars,double dealing etc., all hindering the progress and future of the Highlands for as long as the Highlands have had people living here. However there is one fundamental that is largely ignored! The Highlands of Scotland if full of damn all! Magnificent scenery that is true, but little else and just like the past the young of today if they have a grain of sense get out!They often return as tourists and they sometimes retire back to the Highlands. In my lifetime I have seen the exodus of the young speed up and frankly who can blame them!There is and never has been any future for them in the Highlands.With the advent of modern transport, the Internet, television and so on this can only speed up their exit.

So what/who is left? Old fogies like me who find that the inevitable changes difficult to swallow on occasion however realistic we try to be. Do we want the "Highland way" to disappear into the mists of time without a thought? No I don't think so, but doing the "King Canute" stunt will not help either. That is why I try to to get people to take those rose tinted glasses off when they get carried away with all that Victorian tourist industry clap trap. That is why I and others bang on about the right and wrong way to wear the kilt and so on. Meaningless drivel to some who do not care about the Highlands of Scotland and just want to wear a pretty coloured skirt and that is, by the way, fair enough. But I know that there are others who wish to learn about where the kilt came from and the REAL history of its homeland.

So what about kilt making and wearing in the Highlands, how do we up here see it all ?Well the impression I have is that there are ever fewer kilt-makers in the Highlands and those that are here, most, not all, get their kilts made in Glasgow or Edinburgh, very few kilts are actually made in the Highlands these days---were they ever I wonder?The more kilts worn will mean more kilts made and sold, but not much of that will benefit the economy of the Highlands.

So there we are, the last of the traditional of Highland kilt wearers who actually know and care about the finer points of kilt wearing trying to preserve what we know before its gone forever ------do I really believe that? Well yes I think I do.I give it one, perhaps two generations, no more. The Highland traditions for assorted reasons are and have been diluted for centuries and that is no ones fault, it is inevitable as the world passes through its lifespan and times and priorities change and will continue to do so. The future of the kilt is assured of that I am sure, the traditions that go with it will, I am sorry to say, be lost. Does that matter to enough of the world?I fear not.

Sorry to ramble on, but your question is so huge that this is the best I can do for a short answer!

[Richard]

I doubt that many civilian Highlanders would wear the kilt in London(apart from the Tartan Army) as many up here still think that the kilt should only be worn in Scotland and a large proportion of those will consider wearing the kilt below Perth(Scotland) as too far South!

I love wearing my kilt whenever I can and you can't get anymore south than me, if I go anymore south I would get my feet wet

[Cygnus]

That is a bit depressing, Jock, but seems to be the way of things.

Hopefully you can take some solace in the fact that you are passing the traditions on, even if most of those who embrace them aren't native to, or currently residing in, the Highlands.

[piperdbh]

What Jock says about traditions dying and being replaced with something else is exactly the issue in my little corner of the world, too. I get sort of nostalgic about speechways, expressions, accents, dialects, stories, music and a few other culture identifiers that I see slipping away from the southern Appalachians, mainly because they are not being preserved and passed along to young people, who are picking up a different way of thinking, speaking and "culturing" (new word), with most of the influence coming from popular media. I find it ironic (and in another way insulting) that some people will go out and study and preserve cultures of peoples who are far away, but will let (even speed) nearby culture slip away.

Back to the OP, please let us know what you decide, and remember to post pictures!

[Jock Scot]

That is a bit depressing, Jock, but seems to be the way of things.

Hopefully you can take some solace in the fact that you are passing the traditions on, even if most of those who embrace them aren't native to, or currently residing in, the Highlands.

I have many incommers as friends, but I have never seen one wearing the kilt and I have never been asked about the kilt by any of them.

[Cygnus]

I have many incommers as friends, but I have never seen one wearing the kilt and I have never been asked about the kilt by any of them.

Ah, but what about all of the X-Markers that you're teaching? We may not be "True Highlanders" or living in the Highlands, but we are learning!

[Tobus]

Yes you are quite correct the Scottish Government in recent years have tried to swell the population of the Highlands, how that plan is progressing I don't know

I don't mean to steer the thread on a different track, but can you perhaps point me to a source for more info on this? Do they have a government website or an organizational source of info for this program? I'd like to find out more, just for curiosity's sake.

In my lifetime I have seen the exodus of the young speed up and frankly who can blame them!There is and never has been any future for them in the Highlands.With the advent of modern transport, the Internet, television and so on this can only speed up their exit.

Interesting insight. I would have thought it would be the other way. Here in the USA, the internet has actually enabled people to make a good living and be successful without having to go to where the action is (like cities). I would think that, for example, it would be easier to run a web-based business in the Highlands these days, which would perhaps make it easier for people to stay in their homeland instead of having to leave to find success.

[Jock Scot]

I don't mean to steer the thread on a different track, but can you perhaps point me to a source for more info on this? Do they have a government website or an organizational source of info for this program? I'd like to find out more, just for curiosity's sake.


Interesting insight. I would have thought it would be the other way. Here in the USA, the internet has actually enabled people to make a good living and be successful without having to go to where the action is (like cities). I would think that, for example, it would be easier to run a web-based business in the Highlands these days, which would perhaps make it easier for people to stay in their homeland instead of having to leave to find success.

Yes I am sorry we have gone off the track somewhat, interestingly the original question and many of the answers confirm my thoughts.That is just an observation, not in any way, a criticism.

To answer Tobus's questions before getting back on course. I don't know how the Government's scheme works, but I am pretty certain that there is no financial incentive from them.

The problem with the Internet type business is if you are manufacturing, buying or selling finished goods, the Highlands is so far away from the market place where the money is. If it ideas or pictures you are selling, then an Internet business should work pretty well.Also I am not at all sure that the internet is available to all up here.