MacDonald or Gillis from Isle of Lewis - circa 1804

[Nathan]

I've been trying to prove my great great grandmother Mary Gillis of the Skye Glen, Nova Scotia (CBI) area was descended from the Gillis' that settled the area...can't even find her...lots of Mary Gillis' though...don't think women counted for much then.

He came from Lewis, which is a very Protestant Island, but the family established itself in a Catholic part of Nova Scotia so they changed denominations. As I mentioned, Malcolm's father in law was a Protestant minister.

[CMcG]

After having seen a number of transcription errors, inaccuracies, and omissions in the data used by Ancestry.ca, I'm starting to think double checking actual copies of the records is a good idea...

Here's a book in the reference library or U of T that might be of some use in your search:

Lawson, James.1990Emigrant Scots : an inventory of extant ships manifests (passenger lists) in Canadian archives for ships travelling from Scotland to Canada before 1900


http://www.torontopubliclibrary.ca/d...92886&R=292886

http://search.library.utoronto.ca/UT...ch_form_simple

[SeumasA]

If you're ready to dig for records in the Hebrides, check out GENUKI: Scotland for a bunch of resources and links: http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/sct/

CMcG: Thanks for that link. It looks pretty interesting.
Nathan, good luck with your search. I don't envy you trying to track down one particular Angus McDonald in the Hebrides and western highlands.

[CMcG]

I was at the U of T library today and decided to follow up on something for Nathan. I'll detail the process in case anyone else is interested in getting beyond what is available online.

Ancestry.ca/com has access to one of the biggest indexes for immigration material, Passenger and Immigration Lists Index, 1500s-1900s. An index is a database that points to archival material; it tells you where to look, but only gives a partial indication of what you might see in the original source. I used it to find some leads on my own ancestors and found one for Nathan's family tree as well.

At U of T, I went up to the reference section and looked at Whyte's book, which I mentioned earlier in this thread. In there I found a reference for a Malcolm MacDonald who emigrated to Nova Scotia from the Hebrides before 1810, was married to Mary Gillis, and had a son named Angus. If was was of a mind to do so, they could also follow the citation in Whyte's book to the original archival documents and then go see them or order copies.

Now, this is only a partial match for the info that Nathan provided earlier because there are some discrepancies. The Malcolm I found is listed as coming from Canna, not Lewis and has other children, but no John. I'll send the full reference to Nathan for him to compare to the other info he already has. Nonetheless, it might be worth considering, if only because record keeping in those days was a bit "loose"... my 3 X great grandfather was born in 1801, 1803, 1805, or 1811 and in either Scotland or Ireland, depending on which Census or church record you look at

Also, I found out that there was a census taken in Cape Breton in 1811, when it was a separate colony from Nova Scotia. Not all of the island would have been surveyed and some parts of it have not survived, but there is a "Malcom McDonald" listed.
http://www.capebretongenweb.com/1811...tml#unnumbered

Note the difference in spelling. Searching in online indexes can be a pain when one must do a new search for each alternate spelling... Ancestry.ca is pretty good at some alternate spellings or phonetically similar names, but misses other ones

One more thing, is a potential land grant to Malcom McDonald:

"1809
McDonald, Malcom
Petition to Nepean: Petitioner, age 35, was born on the Island of Barray, Great Britain, and has resided at Bras d'Or the past five years. He is married and has four children. He asks a title to the land on which he lives. He is the uppermost settler on the southern side of the Narrows."

Cape Breton no.: 499
NSARM microfilm: 15790

I found that reference in the Nova Scotia (virtual) Archives:
http://www.gov.ns.ca/nsarm/virtual/land/

This may all be old news to you, Nathan. If so, I apologize and hope that other people may at least get some benefit out of the research process. I know you are hoping for records back in Scotland, but I might at least help you get you some leads to check out or narrow your search, which is better than a genealogical brick wall

[creagdhubh]

Well done, Colin!

[Nathan]

I was at the U of T library today and decided to follow up on something for Nathan. I'll detail the process in case anyone else is interested in getting beyond what is available online.

Firstly, thank you very much. You are generous with your time and intellect. I greatly appreciate it. Hope it went well with your own family research!

At U of T, I went up to the reference section and looked at Whyte's book, which I mentioned earlier in this thread. In there I found a reference for a Malcolm MacDonald who emigrated to Nova Scotia from the Hebrides before 1810, was married to Mary Gillis, and had a son named Angus. If was was of a mind to do so, they could also follow the citation in Whyte's book to the original archival documents and then go see them or order copies.

Now, this is only a partial match for the info that Nathan provided earlier because there are some discrepancies. The Malcolm I found is listed as coming from Canna, not Lewis and has other children, but no John. I'll send the full reference to Nathan for him to compare to the other info he already has. Nonetheless, it might be worth considering, if only because record keeping in those days was a bit "loose"... my 3 X great grandfather was born in 1801, 1803, 1805, or 1811 and in either Scotland or Ireland, depending on which Census or church record you look at

It's a pretty common name and there's actually another Malcolm MacDonald in the Antigonish area that many people are descended from. Still, something could have been transcribed wrong. He was certainly from Lewis. Not sure how I would ever determine if it was him with several mistakes (Canna, no John) or if it was someone else.

Also, I found out that there was a census taken in Cape Breton in 1811, when it was a separate colony from Nova Scotia. Not all of the island would have been surveyed and some parts of it have not survived, but there is a "Malcom McDonald" listed.
http://www.capebretongenweb.com/1811...tml#unnumbered

Note the difference in spelling. Searching in online indexes can be a pain when one must do a new search for each alternate spelling... Ancestry.ca is pretty good at some alternate spellings or phonetically similar names, but misses other ones
One more thing, is a potential land grant to Malcom McDonald:

"1809
McDonald, Malcom
Petition to Nepean: Petitioner, age 35, was born on the Island of Barray, Great Britain, and has resided at Bras d'Or the past five years. He is married and has four children. He asks a title to the land on which he lives. He is the uppermost settler on the southern side of the Narrows."

Cape Breton no.: 499
NSARM microfilm: 15790

Well the spelling isn't a problem. On Angus' grave stone and obit, the name is spelled McDonald. However, Malcolm never went to Cape Breton. My family stayed on mainland Nova Scotia for another 4 generations before my great-grandfather moved to Cape Breton, so the Malcolm in the census is another guy. From Barra not Lewis and asking for a land grant in Cape Breton. My Malcolm arrived in Pictou and established himself at Arisaig where he was buried by the shore.

I found that reference in the Nova Scotia (virtual) Archives:
http://www.gov.ns.ca/nsarm/virtual/land/

This may all be old news to you, Nathan. If so, I apologize and hope that other people may at least get some benefit out of the research process. I know you are hoping for records back in Scotland, but I might at least help you get you some leads to check out or narrow your search, which is better than a genealogical brick wall

And I can't tell you how much I appreciate the effort. Doesn't look like we hit pay dirt here but you certainly went above and beyond the call of duty. Trying to find a particular Malcolm or Angus McDonald in North Eastern Nova Scotia or the Hebrides is a needle in a haystack type of exercise. Thanks again!

[CMcG]

Firstly, thank you very much. You are generous with your time and intellect. I greatly appreciate it. Hope it went well with your own family research!
...
And I can't tell you how much I appreciate the effort. Doesn't look like we hit pay dirt here but you certainly went above and beyond the call of duty. Trying to find a particular Malcolm or Angus McDonald in North Eastern Nova Scotia or the Hebrides is a needle in a haystack type of exercise. Thanks again!

Oh well, at least I tried

My own family research is just as much of a needle in a haystack type exercise at this point because I've got my tree mapped out in Canada, with documentary evidence, but can't get back across the pond. I've got a couple leads from the indexes to follow up on in the archives, but I'm not getting my hopes up

[Elizabeth]

Just a quick note... Obituaries often have wrong information in them, they are a clue, not gospel. The bereft, neighbors, and pastors are not reliable sources. When you see in records such as ship manifests, other travel records and sometimes church documents that someone was from "somewhere" it might not be that they were born there or their family was from there... it might mean where they JUST came from. This is most common on ship records.

I am just starting to learn about Scottish research, oh boy, lots to learn!

[Nathan]

Just a quick note... Obituaries often have wrong information in them, they are a clue, not gospel. The bereft, neighbors, and pastors are not reliable sources. When you see in records such as ship manifests, other travel records and sometimes church documents that someone was from "somewhere" it might not be that they were born there or their family was from there... it might mean where they JUST came from. This is most common on ship records.

I am just starting to learn about Scottish research, oh boy, lots to learn!

Fair enough and thanks for sharing what you've learned. The thing is, I'm not going solely based on an obituary. I'm basing this on:

A) My family's oral and written tradition of where we come from. Malcolm's grandson and Angus' son, Malcolm, wrote a fairly detailed family history which was transcribed and added to by father's aunt and circulated through the family.
B) The grave stone that clearly says, "A Native of Lewis, Scotland". They could have put anything on the gravestone but chose to etch in stone that he was a proud son of Lewis.
C) The obituary which has been handed down from generation to generation.
D) Conversations with elderly members of the community who remember some of these people and the Lewis dialect of Gaidhlig they spoke.

Everything fits together. Angus converted to Catholicism the year after he arrived in Canada. If he arrived from Barra for example, he likely would have already been Roman Catholic.

That said, if he was 65 and not 64, that would be conceivable.

After years of research, we've filled in many branches of the tree besides the paternal line that has been handed down. Unfortunately, it's that jump across the pond that's been elusive. I'll get there.

[Elizabeth]

Good luck Nathan, my comment was more generalized than pointing at you. Sorry I didn't make that clear.

If you have not done the Autosomal DNA test yet you should consider it. The field is new but is exploding with possibilities and hopefully soon technology will catch up to where we know it is going. Can't wait till the databases include more over the pond people, I'm patiently (not really!) waiting.