Rethinking Irish Kilts (and a previously unseen vintage pic!)

[macwilkin]

Mea culpa...you are quite right; green was used by the United Irishmen during the '98 Rebellion. Ironically, a majority of the leadership were Protestants.

T.

[Zardoz]

I have plenty of Irish roots on both sides of my parents, in addition to Scottish, and will not say never to the idea someday of wearing an Irish kilt. For now, all I can say is, where is Zardoz? He is the epitome of the Irish diaspora in kilt.

Late to the party! I dunno if I'm the epitome of anything, but I am mostly Irish, and do wear the kilt in saffron and Irish themed tartans as a part of that Celtic identity.

[Flynn]

Just a small quibble, it's properly Padraig ​Pearse.

[CMcG]

Just a small quibble, it's properly Padraig ​Pearse.

I suppose if we are really being proper it should be Pádraig Mac Piarais

[macwilkin]

Related to the subject, here is an interesting wee article about the Irish Free State's ceremonial guard, the famed Blue Hussars:

http://www.andrewcusack.com/2010/04/...-blue-hussars/

One interesting point made:

Originally, the artist Seán Keating headed up a committee to design a uniform in a suitably modern-but-Celtic style, as was the general artistic bent of the Irish state at the time. Keating’s design called for a saffron léine tunic with six rows of black braid, black cuffs, a blue brat cloak, pantaloons, and a black Balmoral bonnet with saffron feather.

The Irish Army rejected this proposal.

[MacLowlife]

Slightly Off Topic...

Two points about St Patrick's Day- and Irish kilts.

We have discussed before the association between Irish firefighters and policemen and pipers, especially at funerals. I think this is a largely North American phenomenon.

I find it odd that the modern celebration of St Patrick's Day- which concentrates on excess and sometimes verges into licentious behavior- falls smack in the middle of Lent. This forum may be too high-minded a place to say it, but when I was a child, we always made sure to wear green on St Patrick's Day in order to avoid being pinched.

[Flynn]

I suppose if we are really being proper it should be Pádraig Mac Piarais

Oh dear, I've been out pedanted.

[O'Callaghan]

Just a small quibble, it's properly Padraig ​Pearse.

AFAIK he was christened Patrick, but preferred to go by the Irish version, pronounced something like Porrig, but spelt Padraig. His father was English, so his last name would definitely have been the Anglo version, at least on his birth certificate. OTOH, Eamonn deValera was an American, and wound up running the country largely because his US citizenship saved him from execution, for fear of a diplomatic incident. All his contemporaries amongst the leadership were killed by the British, except one other, and she was a woman. The, to us, odd sensibilities of the time saved her from death and kept her out of office for the same reason.

[OC Richard]

I find it odd that the modern celebration of St Patrick's Day- which concentrates on excess and sometimes verges into licentious behavior- falls smack in the middle of Lent.

"Archbishop Schwietz explained that as long as the feast day is on the church’s calendar of feasts, the faithful may celebrate the feast in Lent. He added that when the feast day falls on a day of abstinence from meat, such as a Friday in Lent, the local bishop may grant a special dispensation from the law of abstinence for the celebration.

Archbishop Schwietz noted that in the past, when St. Patrick’s day has fallen on a Friday and at the request of St. Patrick’s Church in Anchorage, he has given a dispensation to the parish for its celebration that includes a traditional Irish meal of corned-beef and cabbage."

[O'Callaghan]

Mea culpa...you are quite right; green was used by the United Irishmen during the '98 Rebellion. Ironically, a majority of the leadership were Protestants.

T.

The reason that most of them were Protestants is that the laws of the time (repealed long before independence) required people to be not just Protestant but more specifically Church of Ireland to belong to a profession or own land. This fairly described anybody in a leadership position, whether their heart was in that religion or not. The Church of Ireland is a branch of the Anglican church, known as the Church of England in England and as the Episcopalian Church in America and Scotland.

The strange thing is that the 'planters', who were given land in return for their presence deliberately interfering with demographics, were of a variety of religious sects, likely even including a few Catholics, and certainly including Methodists and Presbyterians as well as Anglicans, but I suppose their qualification was the negative one of not being native Irish. The largest group among them were lowland Scots who attended the Presbyterian church.

For full disclosure I am English, but 1/8 Irish, an atheist, and of what the Irish would call a 'mixed' background (i.e. including both Catholic and Protestant ancestry, and in my case probably more than that).