Sword Question?

[KumaSan]

I think Daz is referring to Muso Gonnosuke, who got beat by Musashi, then went and forumlated a new way of fighting with a slightly shorter stick (now known as Shinto Muso Ryu), and came back and beat Musashi in the rematch. I believe that these two only fought twice.

[Shay]

How I laughed when i first saw the words Chairperson and postperson.

Me too- why not call them chairwoman or postman if they are in fact, that gender? It's when speaking in generalities that it gets a little silly- the Chairmen instead of the Chairs, or postmen instead of post office personnel. (Not all of whom are men or even, strictly mail carriers, y'know?) (PS- I like gender-neutral language)

The 'a' isn't silent, BTW, I don't know what you mean by that. Are you talking about the plural 'men' when attached to a word? (Just curious- I've never heard that before)

Anyway- the Japanese stick and sword story- Miyamoto Musashi, whom the story is about, then became Japan's greatest swordsman, and it was only due to his (really good) opponent underestimating him and being sloppy with over-confidence that he managed to get in and whack the guy in the head with a boat oar. It's a story about overconfidence in one's weapon more than anything else.

[highlander_Daz]

the word man "man" means a male person, but when attached directly to a noun as in "postman" or "fireman" or "chairman" the word is pronounced correctly as "mn" silent "a" and is none gender specific. eg a "chairman" could be either sex whereas a "chair man" is a man whos has something to do with a chair. maybe with an american accent the "a" might not be silent. But then they dont speak English proper like we does. pedantic? yep and im not even English

[KumaSan]

Anyway- the Japanese stick and sword story- Miyamoto Musashi, whom the story is about, then became Japan's greatest swordsman, and it was only due to his (really good) opponent underestimating him and being sloppy with over-confidence that he managed to get in and whack the guy in the head with a boat oar. It's a story about overconfidence in one's weapon more than anything else.

Different guy. That was Kojiro Sasaki, and he was defeated by Musashi who was wielding a cut down oar. Muso Gonnosuke used a stick to beat Musashi.

[Shay]

the word man "man" means a male person, but when attached directly to a noun as in "postman" or "fireman" or "chairman" the word is pronounced correctly as "mn" silent "a" and is none gender specific. eg a "chairman" could be either sex whereas a "chair man" is a man whos has something to do with a chair. maybe with an american accent the "a" might not be silent. But then they dont speak English proper like we does. pedantic? yep and im not even English

Hmmm... I'm looking online for anything to back that up as a linguistic fact rather than an opinion (and a good opinion, don't get me wrong! I like the idea) but I'm not seeing anything- is this in the rules of style or the dictionary someplace where I can show folks?

KumaSan- Dang, I was close! I'm glad I remembered the story right, at least, my training instructor told us it in basic training and related it to people who have fancy impressive guns but get stabbed because they don't set sentries.

[KumaSan]

It's just really good timing on my part. I was actually just reading up on Shinto Muso Ryu on Monday, so the stories are all fresh in my mind. Also, there's some speculation that Musashi purposefully showed up late looking pretty rumpled in order to put Sasaki off of his game. A little OpDec in action.

[highlander_Daz]

http://www.unc.edu/depts/wcweb/handouts/gender.html

http://www.bible-researcher.com/inclusive.html


http://www.geocities.com/bible_translation/glossg.htm

as the chap in the first website states "the US Declaration of Independence states that " . . . all men are created equal"

this is a tricky one my understanding that Men means a male person, no one would suggest that the constitution applies only to men.

[highlander_Daz]

Dictonary.com

"A human regardless of sex or age; a person"

"Usage Note: Traditionally, many writers have used man and words derived from it to designate any or all of the human race regardless of sex. In fact, this is the oldest use of the word. In Old English the principal sense of man was “a human,” and the words wer and wyf (or wæpman and wifman) were used to refer to “a male human” and “a female human” respectively. But in Middle English man displaced wer as the term for “a male human,” while wyfman (which evolved into present-day woman) was retained for “a female human.” Despite this change, man continued to carry its original sense of “a human” as well, resulting in an asymmetrical arrangement that many criticize as sexist. ·Nonetheless, a majority of the Usage Panel still accepts the generic use of man, although the women members have significantly less enthusiasm for this usage than the men do. For example, the sentence If early man suffered from a lack of information, modern man is tyrannized by an excess of it is acceptable"

[Shay]

The constitution of the US when written did apply only to certain people. The language reflects the gender (if not color) gap in rights. Only comparatively recently have we recognised the rights of blacks(1965) and women(1920) to vote and share in full citizenship. However, if the authors meant 'man' in the sense of all humankind, surely here wouldn't have been laws regarding slaves and wives as property? We've changed the meaning of the words by expanding their definition, but the words as they were being written did not allow for women.

As for the other articles, while interesting, they don't mention the dropping of the 'a', which was what I was asking about. I'm sorry I wasn't clear in my question. Hmmm... maybe we should take this to PM...

[Archangel]

It's just really good timing on my part. I was actually just reading up on Shinto Muso Ryu on Monday, so the stories are all fresh in my mind. Also, there's some speculation that Musashi purposefully showed up late looking pretty rumpled in order to put Sasaki off of his game. A little OpDec in action.

also to do the sunrise thing, it's been awhile since I went over this, how refreshing.