joining the clan

**macwilkin** · 12th November 08, 11:22 AM

Originally Posted by Dirk Skene

I'm fairly disrespectful of any one that tells me how I may or may not dress.

I don't believe anyone did tell you how or how not to dress, Dirk. I'm sorry you perceived it that way.

Todd

**Matty Ross** · 11th November 08, 08:45 PM

I joined the Ross Clan Society of America several years back. I maintained membership for some time. Things got a little tight financially and I let my membership lapse. I recently looked into joining again. So now I ask myself what does $25.00 a year get me that I don't already have? A newsletter and a name tag to wear at the Highland games. I spent my money on a new Thrifty kilt instead. I am Matty Ross of the Clan ROSS. I am just not a member of the local society anymore.

**MacMillan of Rathdown** · 11th November 08, 10:05 PM

There is an argument to be made that "clanship" can only be achieved or claimed if one is recognized as a member of the clan by the chief (who has the absolute authority to decide who is, and who is not, a member of his clan), a point that appears to be well supported by Adams, Innes of Learney, and Way of Plean. If one chooses not be a member of their clan society, by which means the chief of that clan recognizes his clanfolk, how can one be a member of the Clan? It would seem to me that without chiefly recognition, even by as circuitous a route as through membership in a clan society, one would be, at best, a stranger to the clan-- albeit a stranger with a similar name.

**macwilkin** · 12th November 08, 05:40 AM

Originally Posted by Matty Ross

I joined the Ross Clan Society of America several years back. I maintained membership for some time. Things got a little tight financially and I let my membership lapse. I recently looked into joining again. So now I ask myself what does $25.00 a year get me that I don't already have? A newsletter and a name tag to wear at the Highland games. I spent my money on a new Thrifty kilt instead. I am Matty Ross of the Clan ROSS. I am just not a member of the local society anymore.

Did you volunteer to help man a society tent at the local highland games? Write an article for the newsletter? Run for office?

You only get out of an organization what you put into it, Matty. As an officer in a clan society, I hear this kind of comment a lot, and I always respond: "What will you do to help then?"

Respectfully,

Todd

**Downix** · 12th November 08, 06:46 AM

Originally Posted by cajunscot

Did you volunteer to help man a society tent at the local highland games? Write an article for the newsletter? Run for office?

You only get out of an organization what you put into it, Matty. As an officer in a clan society, I hear this kind of comment a lot, and I always respond: "What will you do to help then?"

Respectfully,

Todd

I'll second this. I know I haven't joined the Stewart Society due to the lack of time to properly commit to it. If I wanted worthless papers to hang on the wall, well, I could buy up shares of GM.

**Matty Ross** · 12th November 08, 08:30 AM

Did you volunteer to help man a society tent at the local highland games? Write an article for the newsletter? Run for office?

You only get out of an organization what you put into it, Matty. As an officer in a clan society, I hear this kind of comment a lot, and I always respond: "What will you do to help then?"

At the time there were no Highland games close to where I was living and I really had nothing to offer the newsletter or the society leadership. However I do acknowledge you are correct. You get out of any organization what you are willing to contribute. No doubt at some time in the future I may pony up the $25.00 a year and be listed among the loyal followers. My point is regardless of any Society membership, I am and will always be:
MATTY ROSS of the clan ROSS
Member by Birthright not by subscription

**AcuteEnigma** · 16th November 08, 07:35 PM

Originally Posted by Matty Ross

I joined the Ross Clan Society of America several years back. I maintained membership for some time. Things got a little tight financially and I let my membership lapse. I recently looked into joining again. So now I ask myself what does $25.00 a year get me that I don't already have? A newsletter and a name tag to wear at the Highland games. I spent my money on a new Thrifty kilt instead. I am Matty Ross of the Clan ROSS. I am just not a member of the local society anymore.

It gets you information you might not otherwise get AND you support your family.
My gateway ancestor who came over in 1698 died about 1743 and no one had found a will because the courthouse and records burned down in the late 1800's.

Then lo and behold! A small genealogy club in North Carolina(?) published a set of wills which used an old will to establish legal rights to some property.
YUP! That was our ancestor's long lost will.

I would never have known if I wasn't part of the society.

**dowofbuchanan** · 12th November 08, 12:59 AM

well now my turn to ring in on this again and clarify ... family history goes back to 1450 something at my grandmas house not davidson for sure (damn good too as they were loyal to the british huns) buchanan is my family clan ... however the buchanan society only allows membership to the 5-6 major heads not the lowly septs such as my own ill wear any tartan that suits me but id like to be able to say im a member of clan ....... and mean it for myself rather than just long buried ancestors

**Keys MacQuarrie** · 12th November 08, 01:14 AM

Hmmm. Clan MacQuarrie can trace it's roots all the way back to King Alpin with the first recorded clan chief dying in, I believe, 833 and is a VERY old and respected clan. The sad truth is that the last chief died in the early 1800's without any issue, but truth be told, as long as I'm alive, and able to trace my lineage back to King Alpin, Clan MacQuarrie remains a clan.

**O'Callaghan** · 12th November 08, 03:04 AM

Heralds were originally blowers of trumpets and recorders of battle honours, for which they had to be able to recognise the combatants by their livery. From that they grew to be authorities and eventually arbiters of what we now call heraldry. However, it has come to a sad point if a herald can tell you whether you exist.

For the record, 'The O'Callaghan' at the time was recognised by the Irish Record Office before they ceased to carry out that function, and he still has a living direct descendant who claims the title, albeit a Spanish citizen. However, as far as I can tell, the Callaghan clan society appears to be defunct, as they are not reachable at the last known address.

So, we have a chief but no society. I certainly don't believe that there has to be a society to tell the chief who is a member of the clan, as there were no societies when the clans had any real power, and that goes the same for the Scots.

I agree with the point of view that a clan abides as long as one descendant draws breath. If there is even one left then there is always someone who could claim the title of chief, and a herald would be presumptious to say anything more than whether they are entitled to a particular coat of arms.