A question for veterans?

[Monkey@Arms]

First, Attworth, good luck at BMT. What AFSPC are you going into?

My point about respecting the tartan would be much like what my Marine brother stated. Going to a renn fair and wearing a tail with the tartan, no shirt, and generally being an a** would qualify to me as disrespecting the tartan. Maybe us old leathernecks take our "uniforms" too seriously. I don't know, since I'm fairly new to kilts, if a Wallace or a MacAurthur or any other person proud of their clan saw someone wearing their tartan, and generally being a baffoon, would you feel the need to say something? I'll go back to chewing on bullets and await opinions.

Good Luck again Attworth, and get yourself an Air Force tartan when you graduate!

Interesting thought, but where do you draw the line? Do you personally dress down active duty service personnel getting rowdy on a Friday night while wearing a t-shirt that identifies their branch of service because they're disrespecting the t-shirt? What about an office worker acting the fool while wearing an L.L. Bean button down shirt that happens to be in a service-related tartan?

No answers, just questions . . .

Best regards,

Jake

[Splash_4]

Interesting thought, but where do you draw the line? Do you personally dress down active duty service personnel getting rowdy on a Friday night while wearing a t-shirt that identifies their branch of service because they disrespecting the t-shirt? What about an office worker acting the fool while wearing an L.L. Bean button down shirt that happens to be in service-related tartan?

No answers, just questions . . .

Best regards,

Jake

How would this be any different than a yahoo picking up military surplus items and doing the same thing?

As an aside, as far as I know none of the US military services have adopted a tartan for themselves. The tartans named for the branches are for all intents fashion tartans.

[Birddog]

Interesting thought, but where do you draw the line? Do you personally dress down active duty service personnel getting rowdy on a Friday night while wearing a t-shirt that identifies their branch of service because they disrespecting the t-shirt? What about an office worker acting the fool while wearing an L.L. Bean button down shirt that happens to be in service-related tartan?

No answers, just questions . . .

Best regards,

Jake

Jake, to anser the first question, as a senior NCO, it would depend on their behavior, not what they wear. Are they being disrespectful to others, acting in a way that brings disrespect to the service? You bet I would, that is my responsibility as a SNCO. Too few do it these days, and that is why young airman act the way they do. As far as the office worker, well, I just can't answer that one.

It's a darned shame the services haven't officially adopted their tartans, I think that the Air Force tartan would look great with my Mess Dress jacket. It is a waist cut jacket, and the sharpest uniform the air force has. Sadly, I just don't qualify, yet alone fit, into my old Marine Dress Blues...

[Fedgunner]

the subject of military tartans comes up quite a bit. especially the USMC tartan. one thing that has always confused me, is the concept of wearing the tartan with honor and respect. how does one do that? i ask this question because i'm a RVN vet, who served with the USMC, in the 3rd Marine Amphibious Force. i view these tartans as fashion, they have no real meaning in the armed forces. i'm not trying to stir the pot here, but i can never figure out what the big deal is. semper fi slick USMC 1964-1967 RVN 1965-1967

Let me try to give a picture of lack of respect.

Puking drunk, wearing a che shirt, at a "stop the war" rally.

[hospitaller]

Isn't this post veering a wee bit off course?

Personal opinion back to the original post, and somewhat backed by several replies here and what some of my former Ranger buddies have told me:

I am a member of a WW2 Reenacting unit that portrays the 5th Ranger Battalion (the most decorated in the USAR during the war), famous because of D-Day, Irsch-Zerf campaign, etc.

With this little background info, several members of our unit are active duty and/or former real world Rangers, and they all know and understand that those of us who were not, are not wearing the uniforms and running around 'playing'. They themselves were not Rangers during the war either. None of them has any problem with us, or any other reenactor for that matter because they all understand the real reason behind our activities, that is to educate, to portray events in such a way that history is fun and at the public's fingertips.

Similarly, my view of those privately commisioned 'military' tartans (leatherneck and others) is that, since they are not official attire of their respective branches, there is nothing to feel weary about wearing them.

I dont know, it's like people you see on the streets everyday wearing army jackets, or cammo pants, or army hats, or riding their bikes wearing kevlars, etc.

Are we going to stop every one of them or wonder ourselves whether they are or were veterans or just civilians?

I was in my country of birth's Air Force and that is all the military claims I can make.
If tomorrow I decide to wear a tartan that some company decided to custom make and offer for sale.....well, I'll buy it and wear it if I like it.

No military pretensions on that, as for those who want to fake their service...there will always be those folks.

And they wear tartans, uniforms and medals. Out of our control really.

So, while I see similar attitudes in the kilted community as those in the reenacting world, I choose to simply wear MY kilt and let others wear THEIR kilts any way they see fit.

cheers

[CelticRanger66]

I know we shoudn't care about who wears what and generally I don't but I think whomever buys a military tartan should realize what that symbolism means to those of us who have served and it just strikes a chord sometimes. Like when I see a RANGER tab being worn by those who didn't earn the right to wear one.

[mcvarmit]

Let me try to give a picture of lack of respect.

Puking drunk, wearing a che shirt, at a "stop the war" rally.

mr.fedgunner, do you remember the beer commercial, "tastes great, less filling"? to me this thread kinda sounds like that. last summer my wife asked me why i had all these clan tartans, when my heritage was german, swedish? had no real answer, so i took apart all my kilts and made a quilt outta them. all my new kilts will be universal or fashion tartan kilts. that way if i'm puking drunk, wearing a che shirt, at a stop the war rally and if i'm able to speak i can tell them to buzz off. or word to that effect. its not a perfect plan, but for now its the best i can do.

semper fi
slick

USMC - 1964-1967
RVN - 1965-1967
Sapper - 3rd marine amphibious force

[J Pendleton]

The U.S. Coast Guard tartan is an "official" tartan.

That being said, what I am about to say is not on behalf of anyone; I have no authority-just opinion.

I wrote the history and designed the Coast Guard tartan to allow people to connect with their branch of service. It happened to coincide with the forming of the Coast Guard Pipe Band. To be honest, I never really thought about anyone outside of those with some sort of connection (military past and present, family) wanting to wear it.

It is my understanding, like a uniform shirt without collar devices, the kilt may be recognized as being associated with a branch of service but it isn't a uniform unless you put it with the appropriate uniform articles. Members of the Coast Guard pipe band will wear rate or rank with the uniform and when they are in the kilt with the rest of the uniform, they are indeed in uniform.

But when I designed it, it was with the idea that family members had a way of showing their 'connection' to the Coast Guard too, whether regular, reserve, active duty, retired, veteran, auxiliary.

I cannot reiterate enough I am nobody special and I have no authority. I do not speak for the Coast Guard. Just my own personal experience and opinion. If I saw someone wear it who was not CG, I would be thrilled but I would ask their connection. They may just say, I just like it or they may say I love the Coast Guard. They usually have a story. I, personally, would not be offended but I would not expect them to be wearing anything military related aside from the kilt.

[Birddog]

The U.S. Coast Guard tartan is an "official" tartan.

Interesting points, J. Which made me wonder...IS the US Marines "Leatherneck" an official tartan? It is registered, and it is the only tartan that the Leatherneck band wears. Are the other services tartans "official" as well, being that they are registered?
Being a Marine (Now Air Force), I wear it for the pride I feel with being a Marine, much like your point about family and separated Coasties wear it.(You know I use that term affectionately) Perhaps some of our kilted elders could answer the question for a newly kilted member.

[Birddog]

Just a side note. Looking at Military.com, apparently the US Marine Corps has not adopted the worldwide recognized "Leatherneck" tartan in an official capacity. But hey, we all know what the tartan means to us, even if the folks at higher headquarters don't!