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  1. #1
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    Quote Originally Posted by WVHighlander View Post
    I said if I had my druthers.

    I was going to go with argent in the field however, the over-emphasis of silver as representing peace. However, if I were to follow the traditional rules I would substitute the Azure for Argent...

    I went for blue to represent strength.
    There is no historical basis for the colors on a coat of arms representing any particular virtues.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cygnus View Post
    Or you could make it a fess raguly Gules fimbriated Argent (or Or).

    Not something you see very often, but it would solve the problem.
    Not quite. There is the matter of the other charges which would still be black on blue.
    Kenneth Mansfield
    NON OBLIVISCAR
    My tartan quilt: Austin, Campbell, Hamilton, MacBean, MacFarlane, MacLean, MacRae, Robertson, Sinclair (and counting)

  2. #2
    Mike_Oettle's Avatar
    Mike_Oettle is offline Oops, it seems this member needs to update their email address
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    The so-called meanings of the colours of heraldry have been listed in various armorial treatises, but it seems that down the centuries the majority of heralds paid little attention to these lists.
    I recall reading that one mediæval herald produced a wordy dissertation about the various colours, among which he placed vert (green) stone last, because he felt it to be a vile colour. Subsequently he produced another statement in which he said he had revised his opinion, and instead had a high regard for vert.
    (Incidentally, the French heralds originally used the term vert, but found that it tended to be confused with vair, and sought an alternative term. It is not really understood why they settled on the word sinople, since this word describes earth originating from the Turkish [Anatolian] city of Sinop, which is red-brown. A friend of mine, whose husband was colour-blind, suggested that perhaps the herald who introduced the usage was also colour-blind.)
    Incidentally I have now managed to post an image of my arms – apologies for its size.
    Regards,
    Mike
    The fear of the Lord is a fountain of life.
    [Proverbs 14:27]

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by WVHighlander View Post
    If I could have my druthers...

    Coat of Arms: Azure, a fess raguly gules between in chief, a cross moline sable between two ravens observant of the same, and in base a bear rampant of the third.

    Crest: A gryphon passant sable, holding a sword proper

    Motto: Ego planto mea fortuna (I make my own fate.)
    Two comments:
    1. Why a fess raguly?
    2. You have broken a cardinal rule of heraldry, by placing a colour upon another colour. Either the field should be a metal ( gold or silver ), and the fess a colour, or vice versa. If you changed the tincture of the field to Or or Argent, you could certainly keep the tinctures of the various charges Sable.

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    Ha! Rathdown and I caught the error at the same time!

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    I said if I had my druthers.

    I was going to go with argent in the field however, the over-emphasis of silver as representing peace. However, if I were to follow the traditional rules I would substitute the Azure for Argent...

    I went for blue to represent strength.

  6. #6
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    Snap!

    Quote Originally Posted by JSFMACLJR View Post
    Ha! Rathdown and I caught the error at the same time!
    First past the post!

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    MOR suggested reading, in one of my threads, The symbolisms of heraldry: or, A treatise on the meanings and derivations of armorial bearings by W. CECIL WADE, which I founnd over at Internet Archive. The link:

    http://www.archive.org/stream/symbol...euoft_djvu.txt
    I tried to ask my inner curmudgeon before posting, but he sprayed me with the garden hose…
    Yes, I have squirrels in my brain…

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacMillan of Rathdown View Post
    The idea that colours are allegorical and imbued with symbolic meaning reaches back well before heraldry became common across Europe (or the Russian film maker Eisenstein wrote extensively on colour in the 1940s). The concept popped up from time to time, and most students of heraldry and armoury are aware of Richard Robinson, who in 1583, came up with the following attributes of tinctures woven into a poem based on the Arthurian romance Le Devise des Armes de Chevaliers de la Table Ronde, which was written about 1546; here's a sample:

    OR signifies the four virtues of nobleness, good will,vigour, and magnanimity;
    ARGENT signifies the five virtues of humility, beauty, putiry, clarity, and innocence;
    GULES signifies valiance;
    AZURE signifies renown and beauty;
    SABLE signifies mourning and sorrow;
    VERT (sinople in the poem) signifies honour, love, and courtesy;
    PURPURE signifies moderation and the virtues of liberality, abundance, and richness;

    Precious stones were also used to denote tinctures for blazon in the 15th and 16th centuries; as far as I am aware it was last used by the College of Arms (quite appropriately in my opinion) to blazon a grant of arms to the Gemmological Association of Great Britain in 1967.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bugbear View Post
    MOR suggested reading, in one of my threads, The symbolisms of heraldry: or, A treatise on the meanings and derivations of armorial bearings by W. CECIL WADE, which I founnd over at Internet Archive.
    Which, not coincidentally, gives completely different symbolism to the colors than MoR himself gave just one post earlier.
    Last edited by SlackerDrummer; 29th March 11 at 04:14 PM.
    Kenneth Mansfield
    NON OBLIVISCAR
    My tartan quilt: Austin, Campbell, Hamilton, MacBean, MacFarlane, MacLean, MacRae, Robertson, Sinclair (and counting)

  9. #9
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    Nota Bene

    Quote Originally Posted by SlackerDrummer View Post
    Which, not coincidentally, gives completely different symbolism to the colors than MoR himself gave just one post earlier.
    Just shows you what a changing world we live in. And BTW, I think it would be more accurate to say "completely different symbolism than that referred to by MoR in his post" rather than leave the all-too casual reader with the impression that the ascribed attributes were the product of my own imagination.

  10. #10
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    Mea culpa

    Quote Originally Posted by MacMillan of Rathdown View Post
    Just shows you what a changing world we live in. And BTW, I think it would be more accurate to say "completely different symbolism than that referred to by MoR in his post" rather than leave the all-too casual reader with the impression that the ascribed attributes were the product of my own imagination.
    You are quite right! Which is why I had already edited my post to include yours in quotes so people would know that.
    Kenneth Mansfield
    NON OBLIVISCAR
    My tartan quilt: Austin, Campbell, Hamilton, MacBean, MacFarlane, MacLean, MacRae, Robertson, Sinclair (and counting)

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