Allowed tartans

**Phil** · 11th June 07, 03:00 AM

Apologies if you've seen this before but here is an interesting article which clarifies a few myths about kilt-wearing and tartan entitlement.

http://thecapitalscot.com/pastfeatures/kiltstuf.html

It is only a piece of cloth after all.

**macwilkin** · 11th June 07, 03:43 AM

Originally Posted by Phil

Apologies if you've seen this before but here is an interesting article which clarifies a few myths about kilt-wearing and tartan entitlement.

http://thecapitalscot.com/pastfeatures/kiltstuf.html

It is only a piece of cloth after all.

Phil,

Agreed, tartan is only a piece of cloth -- but for some, that cloth has personal meaning. Different horses for courses and all that.

Regards,

Todd

**Gaisgeil** · 11th June 07, 04:19 AM

FWIW, I kind of agree with you. The argument that anyone wearing my clan's tartan should be taken as them honoring it just doesn't hold water. Case in point I saw a gent wearing ancient Boyd at a games last year and being so inclined I approached him because I don't see it worn that often. It turned out he wasn't even sure what tartan it was and "just liked the colors" that doesn't seem to honor much of anything to be honest.

Also, whoever is was that brought up Beloit's age, that's poor form and such an easy way out of an argument, discredit by age discrimination. Tsk.

So anyway, while I don't care for the practice personally I can't and wouldn't stop anyone from doing so.

**Phil** · 11th June 07, 04:26 AM

Originally Posted by cajunscot

Phil,

Agreed, tartan is only a piece of cloth -- but for some, that cloth has personal meaning. Different horses for courses and all that.

Regards,

Todd

I didn't mean to belittle anybody's feelings of attachment to what they regard as their heritage but to encapsulate all of this in a length of material to the exclusion of others simply on the strength of a name is something I disagree with. How can such exclusivity as posted here come to terms with walking on a carpet in your tartan or sitting on a rug in your tartan? The tartans I wear are Galbraith through family but also Lindsay because I inherited it from my in-laws and know they would be proud I choose to wear it even though I have no claim to any connection with that clan.

**macwilkin** · 11th June 07, 04:42 AM

Originally Posted by Phil

I didn't mean to belittle anybody's feelings of attachment to what they regard as their heritage but to encapsulate all of this in a length of material to the exclusion of others simply on the strength of a name is something I disagree with. How can such exclusivity as posted here come to terms with walking on a carpet in your tartan or sitting on a rug in your tartan? The tartans I wear are Galbraith through family but also Lindsay because I inherited it from my in-laws and know they would be proud I choose to wear it even though I have no claim to any connection with that clan.

Phil,

I would never tell anyone wearing the Cumming tartan who wasn't a Cumming by "blood, ring or backdoor" that they were wrong in wearing it. That would be rude and ungentlemanly. If someone wants to wear it, then great! I would never dream of excluding anyone.

My point was that personally, I only wear tartans I have some connection to. I can't worry about others wear, only myself. Those are standards I uphold myself to, and myself only.

And I would argue, btw, that you do have a connection to Lindsey through your in-laws.

Regards,

Todd

**beloitpiper** · 12th June 07, 11:56 AM

I soooo regret ever starting this thread.

People are free to call me a snob or whatever, but I still believe what I believe. I've heard the argument "tartans have only been associated with clans for the past 150 years or so". Well guess what? They are now associated with clans.

I'm not going to wear a tartan I am not associated with. At the same time I'm not going to attack somebody wearing whatever tartan they please. All I ask, and I want to do this as politely as possible, is that you know and respect what you wear.

**macwilkin** · 12th June 07, 12:26 PM

Originally Posted by beloitpiper

I'm not going to wear a tartan I am not associated with. At the same time I'm not going to attack somebody wearing whatever tartan they please. All I ask, and I want to do this as politely as possible, is that you know and respect what you wear.

There were several of us who share this opinion with you, Greg.

I feel that should be pointed out that those of us who share this opinion aren't saying that it applies to anyone but ourselves, or that we are trying to make "non-Scots" ashamed of wearing a clan tartan, etc. For whatever personal reason, some folks are not comfortable wearing a tartan they have no connection with, just as others are not as worried about it. Different horses for courses, I always say...

I agree with many who say there are no "rules" for wearing tartan, but for many, tartan is a very personal thing. As long as there is mutual respect, then we are all right.

Regards,

Todd

**jdbenson** · 12th June 07, 01:01 PM

All this talk of blue jeans reminds me of a kid I knew years ago, who was NOT ALLOWED to wear blue jeans. Seems his mother came from a very wealthy "Old Money" family, and she equated blue jeans with lower class working folk, and she was not going to allow her son to wear such an article of clothing.

For his mother, blue jeans were not clothes, they were a uniform; or more precisely a symbol. I'm sure at one point in time, that was true. But, nowadays, jeans have outgrown that symbol of working class (Heck, I've seen jeans paired with a tux shirt & jacket at weddings).

Kilts are following in blue jeans' path. They've gone from being merely functional, to being a symbol/uniform of scottish/clan/highland pride. Now as their popularity increases they're becoming more of a fashion statement, just as jeans have done.

Seems to me this is the natural progression of things. Does that mean that the kilt will stop being a symbol of Scottish/Clan/Highland pride? I doubt it. Does that mean that more people will embrace and enjoy the freedom the kilt offers? I hope so. I just hope people take enough time to learn at least a little of the history and heritage of the kilt, and wear them with pride, as I know WE all do.

**O'Cathain** · 12th June 07, 01:45 PM

Matt Newsome sums it up best in his article on The Introduction to Tartan on The Scottish Tartan Museum's Website. I would think that the non-Scottish X Marks members who pick a clan tartan that they like, educate themselves on it. I am more confident wearing a clan tartan of my choosing than a country or district or generic tartan, not to say that I don't like them. It is emulating a country and it's heritage. Just like the purists who wouldn't wear a tartan they are not associated with, I won't wear a tartan that is not associated with a clan.

**macwilkin** · 12th June 07, 02:05 PM

Originally Posted by O'Cathain

Matt Newsome sums it up best in his article on The Introduction to Tartan on The Scottish Tartan Museum's Website. I would think that the non-Scottish X Marks members who pick a clan tartan that they like, educate themselves on it. I am more confident wearing a clan tartan of my choosing than a country or district or generic tartan, not to say that I don't like them. It is emulating a country and it's heritage. Just like the purists who wouldn't wear a tartan they are not associated with, I won't wear a tartan that is not associated with a clan.

Interesting, but I'm not sure about your comparison...I wear a state tartan (Iowa), which symbolizes all of my family who were from Iowa, including my Scots ancestors that I wear my clan tartan for. One symbolises their clan and the land they came from, the other with the land to which they came. To me, district and clan tartans can work very well together. A district tartan also is the perfect alternative for those who may not have a clan tartan, or may not wish to wear one.

So...I'm not sure I understand your reasons for not wearing a district tartan -- care to explain?

Regards,

Todd