And they call themselves men ...

[ckelly327]

Reading through this thread I realized that the other thing lost these days is calling people by their given names. I always know when someone knows me through my family because they will call me Christopher. Others who I introduce myself to know me as Chris. I still see people I grew up with and call them Patrick, Michael, Edward, etc. It's just another side of being raised that way and still calling neighbors Mr. and Mrs. even though some have told me to call them by their first names. I feel comfortable calling most by their surnames. Just another lost touch to society today.

[MacConnachie]

The biggest pile of abuse I've ever suffered personally as a bus driver came from a well-dressed business woman in her 40's. She was concerned about something, and I happened to call her "ma'am". (I use "sir" or "Ma'am" to address ALL my passengers.) Well, you'd think I'd called her the devil!! The abuse that spilled from that woman's mouth would make a biker blush! I could not believe what I was hearing. All because I had the audacity to be polite to her.

Well, then perhaps you WERE mistaken calling her, "Ma'am," because the appearance or inference of her being a lady had nothing to do with her true character. At least, had I been in the same situation, would I have let her know, in no uncertain terms.

Gentlemen (and ladies), the examples cited here have basically to do with one thing. Self-absorption and self-importance taking dominance over self-respect. For if one doesn't have self-respect, then how in blazes can one possess a capacity for respect for others? Otherwise, it would seem one is living a contradiction in such terms. . .

[Alan H]

Interstingly enough, I hold open doors all the time for women around campus and I've never been called to task for it. I've gotten a lot young women who just walk though without s asecond thought and never say thank you, but not flak.

There are women I won't hold a door open for, but those are women who have gone to great lengths to prove to me beyond the shadow of a doubt, over extended periods of time, that while they may be women, they are not ladies.

[The Supreme Canuck]

I think I got the best response I've ever had for holding a door the other day. I was leaving my residence building and I saw a young man walking down the path to get to the door. Now, he was a good distance off (maybe a full minute of walking) but the door locks automatically when it closes. So I decided to hold it for the guy. When he got to me, he looked right into my eyes and said, "Thanks. You know, you really didn't have to do that, buddy." Absolutely sincere. First time that's ever happened.

[davedove]

So you're saying carrying a tourch around and pretending to be a viking while kilted in not a good idea...knew I was doing something wrong...

There's nothing wrong with that, as long as you're courteous.

[bubba]

Y'know, they say good manners is the lubricant in society where people rub together. Unfortunately so many people want to substitute sand for the lubricant.

[Moosehead]

What if it becomes necessary for the breed to evolve to survive? Courtesy and politeness are defined by the society and times in which they are found. If we don't adapt sufficiently to fit into our culture's definition of what is courtesy, do we risk becoming anachronistic, and having our values ignored or supplanted by future generations in favor of someone else's opinions? What are we defining as "the breed"; the adherance to manners, or the concepts of justice and honor? And are they exclusive?

If I must become some type of jackass to survive, then I ask the Almighty to take me now! I will NEVER give up those values which were instilled in me as a child, and I will not tolerate my children to disregard those same values. Any individual without common courtesy, has no self-respect. A man/woman who lives without self-respect, is only pretending to live.

Some have said (tongue in cheek, I hope) that a kilt-wearing man somehow has an instilled sense of honour and respect, merely by donning the garment. Can't agree with that one. I've met more bums on the street with more honour and respect than many business types, whether wearing Armani or whatever.

The kilt is a garment, it has no magical powers. What it may do, is bring out who you truly wish to be.

[mexpiper]

Reading through this thread I realized that the other thing lost these days is calling people by their given names. I always know when someone knows me through my family because they will call me Christopher. Others who I introduce myself to know me as Chris. I still see people I grew up with and call them Patrick, Michael, Edward, etc. It's just another side of being raised that way and still calling neighbors Mr. and Mrs. even though some have told me to call them by their first names. I feel comfortable calling most by their surnames. Just another lost touch to society today.

HERE !HERE! I agree most heartly. The loss of manners and common decency is the begining of the decline of a nation. I think it also falls in with parents complaining to teachers, when their children (who can do no wrong) get bad grades and tell the teachers to change the grades, or they are going to be sued!!

[Wompet]

I still open doors ... and then I hold them open, standing in the doorway so no one can go through...
until my wee little mother, with her osteoporsis and one natural hip, can walk through under my arm, so we don't have to worry about one of the self-centered, sightless idiots from running into her and breaking something, namely her.

I look at how my brothers and I were raised (39, 37, and 32), and then I look at my adopted nephew (15), and I worry where society's headed. My niece (13) gives me hope - she can at least behave properly for the most part around her grandmother.

Supreme Canuck - you're where I was ten years ago. Stick to your principles and use of the common courtesies - you'll be true to yourself, be doing the proper thing, and you'll make a better impression during job interviews than the degenerates.

[Kilted KT]

The kilt is a garment, it has no magical powers. What it may do, is bring out who you truly wish to be.

exactly the sentiment I was trying to convey, although not quite as eloquently!