To the Forum regarding the XMTSAS Saltire

**piperdown** · 24th January 11, 01:36 PM

Originally Posted by A_Hay!

I've been following the discussion for the last few days and would like to share some thoughts for those who might be interested. Of course, if you don't want to read further, you can exit here.

Many years ago I had the opportunity to attend a week long group seminar at the Menninger Clinic in Topeka, Kansas. For those who might not know, the Menninger Clinic is devoted to mental health understanding and care, at least at that time. They also shared their knowledge through these seminars.
At the end of the week, each of us was given a marble egg. Each was the same size and shape, but the colors of the marble stone were different. Each was unique. The gift was that through the week we had come to know about the other seminar members. We were all human beings, but each of us was unique in our experiences and our outlooks on life. We gained new friends, and problably met some folks that we were glad to get away from!
I've kept that egg and considered the lessons learned therefrom for over 30 years.

What does the Egg have to do with the Saltire?

From the posts it seems that some are most concerned about whether Jamie had the right to withdraw it and whether this reflects poorly on his character. Others believe it was his right to do so and stand up for him. Still others could care less.

Another topic seems to be should we have a "new Saltire" or equivalent and if so how to choose what it should be. Some say aye and some say wait, don't rush ahead too soon.

The parallel between the Egg and this subject seems to me that we all have come to this forum with some common interests, although not necessarily the same interests. But like any group, we don't all think alike (like the marbling of the Egg).

The discussion so far also seems to be like the process of grieving (I'm sure Riverkilt could give some insght here on that subject, if he chose to)

I think a discussion of the topics are healthy, as long as they are civil. It is sort of like Brainstorming with new ideas coming out of the presentation of others. I would hope that some consensus will be forthcoming and those who want to move forward with a new symbol will be allowed to do so while those who want to wait or not participate in that aspect of the forum will respect that decision.

For myself, I'm content to be an egg in the carton of this forum and enjoy the X Marks the Scot comradship. I have my own opinions on these subjects, but I'll express them at a different time. This post was not intended to make value judgements on any one. But I think sometimes being aware of the process of human interaction is as productive and as interesting as the subject under discussion.

Respectfully,

Tom
A_Hay!

Not angry. Just trying to point out that this reminds me of a little kid that takes his soccer ball home because he didn't like losing a game. Basically ruining it for the rest of the kids until they find another ball. Seems a little selfish. Really isn't a big deal, and didn't mean to make it one. Let's figure out what the new "ball" should be, and move on. I know there are already other posts discussing this now. Enough said.

:crap::crap::crap:

Take a timeout...go hug your kids/grandkids/mother/grandmother/a friend whos sick...then come back and see it means very much in the grand scheme of things. Thought so

**JSFMACLJR** · 24th January 11, 03:19 PM

Originally Posted by piperdown

Not angry. Just trying to point out that this reminds me of a little kid that takes his soccer ball home because he didn't like losing a game. Basically ruining it for the rest of the kids until they find another ball. :

Why do you think Panache "lost" a game? I think he has shown more poise and honour than many. He has held his head up high.

**artificer** · 24th January 11, 03:27 PM

Originally Posted by JSFMACLJR

Why do you think Panache "lost" a game? I think he has shown more poise and honour than many. He has held his head up high.

Sandy, Piperdown was commenting in the negative on the "lost game- taking ball home" comment. I think you missed his dancing 'crap' signs below his quote

Originally Posted by piperdown

:crap::crap::crap:

I did too, at first.

P/D said

Take a timeout...go hug your kids/grandkids/mother/grandmother/a friend whos sick...then come back and see it means very much in the grand scheme of things. Thought so

**starbkjrus** · 2nd February 11, 06:26 PM

Originally Posted by azwildcat96

Not angry. Just trying to point out that this reminds me of a little kid that takes his soccer ball home because he didn't like losing a game. Basically ruining it for the rest of the kids until they find another ball. Seems a little selfish. Really isn't a big deal, and didn't mean to make it one. Let's figure out what the new "ball" should be, and move on. I know there are already other posts discussing this now. Enough said.

Originally Posted by Drac

Not having the prevlidge of being a "plankowner" of X-mark I will stay out of whether there is an issue between the old and the new. I do not know his reason for leaving or if the is bad blood here.

I do wish to ask is it gentlemannly to rip at someone on a public forum?

Are we a communitty of friends or a clic?

I have not read all 17 pages of this thread nor do I intend to.

The Saltire was the exclusive property of Jaime and he has decided what to do with it.

I'm sorry but everyone else needs to GET OVER IT. Done. and DONE. Geez people.

If there are issues that those nubes of us aren't aware of (and don't want to be) than might those be better handled privately?

Can pay respects to a gentleman, what he has done and to what the meaning was behind the Saltire was or is this communitty different from what I thought it was?

All the heat over it does nothing but destroy what it stood for. Do we really what to force someone to give it up? What meaning would it have than?

Jim

Originally Posted by JSFMACLJR

Why does this forum need a "new ball"?

Originally Posted by The Barry

Maybe we should just use a soccer ball.

I am personally disappointed that I was never able to host the Saltire. I'm also not going to worry about it. I was hoping that it belonged to the larger group of us rather than just to one member, but again, I'm not too worried about it.

I hope that we agree that if we make another 'traveler', it doesn't belong to anybody, and thus can keep traveling even if someone decides to stop being active on this forum.

Originally Posted by Raphael

The Saltire airship has never been the property of xmarksthescot.com. It is developed, owned and operated by Panache. He was nice enough to send the airship around the world and to meet the people that Panache couldn't meet personally. The Saltire may have become something bigger than what Panache had first imagined. But the bottom line is that Panache owns the ship and if he wants the ship to retire, he can.

Move on people.

Done folks -

Get over it!!

**Drac** · 2nd February 11, 06:48 PM

Um, my quote seemed to have gotten a bit longer...

Jim

**artificer** · 2nd February 11, 06:54 PM

Originally Posted by Drac

Um, my quote seemed to have gotten a bit longer...

Jim

lolz

It's a Drac and Alan H. "FrankenQuote"

**Drac** · 24th January 11, 11:03 AM

Not having the prevlidge of being a "plankowner" of X-mark I will stay out of whether there is an issue between the old and the new. I do not know his reason for leaving or if the is bad blood here.

I do wish to ask is it gentlemannly to rip at someone on a public forum?

Are we a communitty of friends or a clic?

If there are issues that those nubes of us aren't aware of (and don't want to be) than might those be better handled privately?

Can pay respects to a gentleman, what he has done and to what the meaning was behind the Saltire was or is this communitty different from what I thought it was?

All the heat over it does nothing but destroy what it stood for. Do we really what to force someone to give it up? What meaning would it have than?

Jim

**Andy Proffitt** · 24th January 11, 11:51 AM

Thank you for the Saltire Jamie, it has obviously brought great joy, otherwise the reactions would not be this strong.
It will be missed, as have your posts been of late.
Be of good cheer.

**Alan H** · 24th January 11, 01:05 PM

Guys, it's really pretty simple. The saltire is a piece of wood, with some other bits and pieces glued on it, and painted in glossy colors. It's the work of a weekend to make another one, or whatever, and ship it wherever you all want it to go.

Whatever you may or may not think about this issue, the saltire is at Panache's house. If he decides to not send it on, then there's nothing you can do about it. Like it or not...agree with it or not, that particular party is over. You can go on and on about whether Panache "owns" the saltire, or whether it "belongs" to X Marks, and all that is pointless. The thing is at Panache's house. You can't FORCE him to send it on....what are you going to do, fly out here and break into his house? Nobody at the next Nor Cal Burns night is going to steal it for you. So debate and expound until you go blue in the face, it's totally pointless.

You all can debate the whole next year away about what else you all want to start shipping around the globe. Truth is, it will only happen when someone gets up the gumption to just MAKE SOMETHING, and find someone to send it to. So....

who's going to talk, who's going to write long paragraphs on the internet, and who is going to get to work in the garage, or at the sewing machine, or wherever and MAKE IT HAPPEN?

Once you ship it off, whoever you are that's going to make it, understand that you might, or you might not ever see it again.