Attitudes To The Kilt.

[Mac Coinneach]

You did not mention his name that I saw. Just curious if it is John Mallernee of Clan Henderson? That would be John Robert Mallernee, US Citizen, Official Bard of Clan Henderson residing at the Armed Forces Retirement Home in Washington, D.C.

First, I would never name any names online, second, I wouldn't say anything that I didn't believe to be true.

Better get those fingers warmed up ... there is a lot of typing to do tonight Mr. Mackenzie making sure native Scots sleep more soundly through your due diligence in being the keeper of all Celtic traditions.

Now regarding the gentleman in question (no, I'm not naming any names to suit your desire for dramatic rumour-mongering), he is an online friend of mine, and someone that I have the utmost respect for. I think it's an immense task he's taken on for himself, and not being raised in a Scottish home only makes it more difficult. Something, I might add, I believe he'd be the first to admit. I've known him for over two years now, and helped him where I could to find his way through Scottish culture, as have friends of mine - one mailed him her Gaidhlig dictionary.

So, other than a bit of instigating, do you have something to add to the conversation?

[Doc Hudson]

So, other than a bit of instigating, do you have something to add to the conversation?

Instigating!! Instigating!!! You are a fine one to be throwing that accusation!!!

First you pop in here and post a bunch of idiotic RULES THAT MUST BE OBEYED, then you mention some vague, annonymous EXPERT ON ALL THINGS SCOTTISH, who isn't even a Scot, to condemn all who disagree with you, and who snorts at the idea of this website.

Either name your oh so fantastic expert or retract him. Quite frankly I doubt if he exists.

You found yourself being hammered right, left, and center by facts, research, and opinions of Lord Lyon himself, and I think you invented this expert to bolster your crumbling position.

So Mac, name him or retract him. Annonymous authority ranks no respect.

[Dreadbelly]

Sir, on behalf of all my fellow X-Markers, I raise my kilt in respect for you and your traditions.

We Douglasses don't take kindly to folk telling us what we can do and can not do. Now that's a tradition you can count on.

[Doc Hudson]

Thank you Dr. Douglas!!!!!

I stole that image for my collection. Thank you most kindly!!!!!

[highlandtide]

So, other than a bit of instigating, do you have something to add to the conversation?

So. Is this a blatant ignoring of the question I asked earlier or did you just not see my post asking if you

a) ever lived in Scotland and
b) why you left if you did live there...

Interesting that you pick all of the other posts apart but ignore this one...

[Doc Hudson]

Hank,

Seems to me that this gentleman chooses to ignore hard questions of all sorts.

[Verlyn]

You may be correct, but my impression of his earlier emails (in this topic and others) has not been so....

To me, this is illustrative of an approach that is inconsistent with one making it clear that opinions held are only ones own. It's not an inclusive approach, but instead, an exclusive one. It's not descriptive, but rather, proscriptive. Traditions developed outside Scotland are not "true" nor "correct." Only in Scotland, he says. What you or I do elsewhere cannot form part of the tradition of the kilt.

Or maybe he meant to say something else.

Good points Kevin. Just trying to get some good out of the posts.

[Blu (Ontario)]

Wow!
I decided to peek in on the board and all I can smell is smoke! Took me 20 minutes to digest the whole thread. It's clear that to some people, the traditional kilt is NOT clothing at all... it is vestments in every sense of the word. To them, tartans and kilts are serious, serious business. The tartan kilt and the wearing of it is to be enshrined in strict rules, exclusivity, tradition and ceremony. Non-Scot men who decide to wear a kilt are obviously either Scot wannabes or girlie-men. They can only offend "true Scots" and embarrass themselves. Quite frankly, after reading all of this, I can detect a lingering scent of paranoia. With such gravity placed on this issue by some folks... is there any joy left in any of it ??

:confused:

[awoodfellow]

I have spent the last hour reading and learning from this great exchange. Captivating.

I am by no means an expert in the realm of tartans, kilts or Scottish history. For the most part I'm in what I like to call the 300+ Club. Meaning my ancestry is 300+ years American. (actually 370 years) While I certainly understand and appreciate the MAC being adamant regarding family tradition, I do not appreciate begin spoken to as though I have no knowledge of any family tradition or history. I'm quite sure a full blown Scotsman would feel the same way. But that's old news now.

In my readings and learning about the kilt, where they came from and why they are named Campbell or MacDonald or MacEwan instead of that nice green one over there with the yellow and red stripe, I ran across an article stating the following... [this isn't quoted, so don't take it as gospel and I don't recall the reference and I could be entirely incorrect]:

As the kilt came back into vogue, following the Great Kilt Outage (my injected humor) purchasers contracted with weavers to create their kilts to which the weavers would design a tartan to the pleasure of the customer, a Campbell in this example. The originally designed tartan was sold to Mr. Campbell. Subsequent customers would visit the weaver and happen to see the tartan fabric used for Mr. Campbell. As the weavers were quite busy designing the patterns, they soon had so many and it was difficult to describe them so the weavers themselves named tartans by the name of the person who placed the original order. So with enquiry on a certain tartan, in this case the tartan Mr. Campbell ordered, the weaver would politely say, oh. that's the Campbell tartan.

*****

Just how true would this be?

Ambrose

[Rick]

I have found this thread quite interesting and in many cases educational. I can not help but realize the many parallels that exist with other garments. I am a cyclist and I happen to like Louis Garneau jerseys. Many of these are based on the Canadian flag or provincial flags. As a native born US citizen, am I not to wear these garments? I grew up literally feet from the Canadian border, I watched and listened to the CBC (still do, via web radio), have traveled more extensively in Canada than many canadians, have sponsored and collaborated with several graduate students at university in Canada. Most importantly, I have great admiration and respect for Canada and what is Canadian. Thus, I feel quite comfortable and correct in wearing these garments. I have many times been asked while on my bicycle or on inline skates "are you Canadian." To which I respectfully reply, "no, but I respect Canada." The flag and what one does with it can be a vary contentious issue, to which those of us in the USA can attest. Yet, no Canadian has ever challenged me as a US citizen for wearing a garment based on their flag.

The key here is respect and understanding for what the symbol means. I am quite comfortable in applying the same simple "rule" of have respect and understanding when selecting a tartan. This would appear to be a commonly held position by many on this board.