Quality Plaid

[xman]

I found some info here about wool edges and it got me thinking about other milling considerations like colour and weave. Can you kind folks enlighten me as to the short comings and strengths of the different mills' handiwork? When it comes time to order my tank, I want to make sure I have a garment I will be fully satisfied with. Keltoi's website for example proclaims that Lochcarron's Strome is considered the best around and if I can pass over a turned edge for a proper selvedge, well that would be a consideration.

X

[M. A. C. Newsome]

Any kiltmaker who has had opportunity to work with cloth from various mills will develop a preference, and I am no different.

Here are my thoughts on cloth from some of the top suppliers of tartan. These comments reflect my personal opinion as a kiltmaker.

D. C. Dalgliesh: Their K/1 heavy weight cloth is superb. It is easy to sew, easy to press, holds a wonderful pleat, has a great feel to it, and is made with a traditional kilting selvedge. Definitely my preference for my personal kilts. Downside: they don't offer a lot of tartans from stock. Upside: they will custom weave enough cloth for just a single kilt. I use this mill for just about all of my custom tartan requests.

Lochcarron: Their heavy weight range is called Strome, and is also an excellent choice. I find it easy to sew, easy to press. It holds a pleat well, and has a nice, strong feel to it. I also personally have made kilts for myself from Lochcarron's Strome and enjoy wearing them. The only minor downside is that this cloth has a tucked selvedge, which although not as good as a traditional kilting selvedge, it is still suitable. I will say that Lochcarron's tucked selvedge looks a lot neater than other mills I have seen that use this selvedge method. Lochcarron stocks a very large number of tartans in their heavy weight range, and for this reason I tend to use them more than any other mill to supply my clients. They stock a smaller number of medium weight tartans. Generally I don't make kilts from medium weight cloth unless the tartan is not available otherwise. But when I do, I find Lochcarron's medium weight also is pretty easy to work with and holds a pleat well.

House of Edgar: Unlike Lochcarron, above, HoE stocks a very large number of tartans in medium weight, and a much smaller number in heavy weight. For this reason, I don't use them as often as I might, and most of my experience with their cloth has been with their medium weight tartans. When I have used their heavy weight tartans, I find the cloth to be comparable to Lochcarron's Strome. As for their medium weight, in terms of workability, I find that I prefer Lochcarron's medium weight. The main thing that I notice is that HoE's cloth is much harder for me to press. It doesn't seem to want to take a crisp pleat as easily as Lochcarron's cloth. I'm not sure why that is, but to me it is the major disadvantage. On the upside, their kilting cloth is woven with a traditional closed kilting selvedge, and they have have some very beautiful colors. A lot of people opt for HoE cloth simply because they like their "muted" color scheme. HoE also weaves regimental tartans in 18 oz cloth, which is really nice to work with.

Strathmore: I have not had enough opportunity to work with cloth from Strathmore to form a solid opinion. What limited experience I have had has been with their W60 medium weight cloth, and it's been comparable to other mill's medium weight ranges. It sews well, is easy to work with. In terms of holding a pleat, I think it lies somewhere between Lochcarron and HoE in that regard. Their selvedge is good. The major reason I have not worked with Strathmore's cloth any more than I have is that they only stock tartans in light and medium weight, and my preference is to work with heavy weight.

Fraser & Kirkbright: I have limited experience with them, mostly sewing kilts from client-supplied cloth, which they purchased from F&K. This Canadian mill uses a merino wool. I'm not sure if that is the major reason for this, but one of the things I immediately noticed about this mill's cloth is that is "feels and behaves" like a lighter weight than it is. I can't explain it beyond that, but their "medium weight" cloth feels more like what I would expect from a light weight cloth from one of the Scottish mills. Likewise their "heavy weight" feels more like a typical medium weight cloth. I also find that it is extremely difficult for me to press a good pleat into this cloth. It seems to want to "spring back" after a pressing. Again, I'm not sure if the merino yarns account for this, or if there is some other factor. Like many mills, they also use a tucked selvedge, though I have noticed it is often "messier" than other mills (for lack of a better term). The cut ends of the yarns are often fuzzier, and the selvedge line is more clearly visible from a distance.

Aside from Harris Tweeds, the occasional Ebay find or client-supplied cloth where I am not sure of what mill did the weaving, this represents the majority of kilt cloth I have experience using. Again, the above represents my personal opinion and preferences only, based on my experience hand sewing over 400 kilts.

[Jock Scot]

Out of interest Matt, how does Harris Tweed compare with its "workability" when making a kilt and does it come with a traditional kilting selvedge? In particular, I am thinking ahead to the wonderful idea of Harris Tweed tartan being available.

[Paul Henry]

Out of interest Matt, how does Harris Tweed compare with its "workability" when making a kilt and does it come with a traditional kilting selvedge? In particular, I am thinking ahead to the wonderful idea of Harris Tweed tartan being available.

Jock, I'm not Matt, but I have worked with Harris tweed many times, and have never found the selvedge to be good enough, perhaps if they are proposing actual tartan fabric , they might be better, but I've always had to hem Harris cloth.
and I'd love to have a harris tartan as well

[ForresterModern]

I do not work the cloth as Matt does, I simply wear it.

I have kilts in 16oz Strome from Lochcarron, 16 and 13oz from Strathmore and HoE and Dalgleish, 13 oz Batley, and 16oz from Marton Mills (Jura) and F&K. All are fine fabric for kilts with the descriptions that Matt gives above being accurate IMHO. The Strathmore and Dalgleish are the best IMHO because of the smooth finish, firm and substantial hand, and very clean selvedge edges. Lochcarron's tuck in selvedge is almost as good. HoE 13 oz fabric is similar in finish but lighter in hand (obviously) but with a good selvedge, while their 16oz (Nevis range) has a bit coarser finish, nice firm hand, but a rather rough tuck-in selvedge by comparison. Batley is coarser still but with a firm hand for weight, and a decent selvedge, but a color palette (thanks Rex) that is much less vivid than comparable from other mills for the same specific tartan. Marton Mills is similar in being a somewhat coarse finish, like HoE Nevis, with a similar rough tuck in selvedge when compared to Lochcarron's. F&K being made of Merino is overall softer and somewhat fuzzier finish with a soft drapy hand and less defined pleat edges, and also can have a pretty rough tuck in selvedge at times. I also came across a piece that had a rather pronounced skew (tartan pattern not at 90 degrees between the warp and weft) which made for a rather troublesome overall look requiring some extra effort on the part of the kiltmaker to do her best to straighten, twice, and still left a bit of a residual skew in the final finished product.

Lochcarron and certain HoE tartans tend to be the most expensive, Strathmore and Dalgleish only slightly less so (unless customed then more expensive), Marton Mills and HoE Nevis next in the price line, with Batley and F&K being the least expensive overall. F&K does run intermittent sales on certain overstock tartans at bargan basement prices (like $25CDN per DW yard/meter). Each mill has its own varied stock and standard run tartans with Lochcarron and HoE and Marton Mills having the broadest range typically, HoE with its relatively unique ranges of Rare and Muted tartans. Batley in the most common clans for the most part, and F&K specializing in Canadian specific tartans.

Really, any of them can make a nice quality kilt, with the differences being not really as noticeable as we all make it sound, unless you really work with the stuff a lot or are experienced and educated about the differences (kind of like wine). Again, one man's opinion of the feel and wear of the various weights and makers of tart I personally have in my closet. Hope this helps.


jeff

[M. A. C. Newsome]

Out of interest Matt, how does Harris Tweed compare with its "workability" when making a kilt and does it come with a traditional kilting selvedge? In particular, I am thinking ahead to the wonderful idea of Harris Tweed tartan being available.

Speaking personally as a kilt maker, I find Harris Tweed easy to work with and easy to sew.

It does not hold as sharp a pleat as worsted wool tartan, but then again, it's not really supposed to. I find that I actually prefer the look of a softer pleat in a Harris tweed.

That's why when I make Harris Tweed kilts my preference is for either a 4 yard box pleated kilt, or a lower yardage (5 or 6) yard knife pleated kilt. With the somewhat wider pleats you will get in either of these styles, a softer pleat looks nice and lays better (in my opinion).

As for the selvage, in the past when I have ordered Harris Tweed cloth in general it's been the luck of the draw. Some has had perfectly beautiful kilting selvage. Others not, and I've had to hem the cloth (not preferable).

However, I've talked with our new supplier of Harris Tweed about this issue, and when we do special runs of tartan cloth, they will be able to ensure a good selvage for kilt making.

Details here:
http://giftshop.scottishtartans.org/custom.htm

[Jock Scot]

Jock, I'm not Matt, but I have worked with Harris tweed many times, and have never found the selvedge to be good enough, perhaps if they are proposing actual tartan fabric , they might be better, but I've always had to hem Harris cloth.
and I'd love to have a harris tartan as well

Thank for that for that Paul. I am sorry, I should have made that an open question. I am far from an expert, but I did wonder and I am not surprised by your answer. I wonder what Nick might have to say on the subject too? In truth, I doubt that I would give it a thought normally, but one can't help but wonder what is proposed with the Harris Tweed tartan. Does hemming take much time? As we all know, time costs money these days and that cost is usually passed on to the customer. Such is life!

[Jock Scot]

Thank you Matt, for a very interesting reply.

[slohairt]

D.C. Dalgliesh: Their K/1 range has an excellent traditional selvedge and a small but interesting assortment of tartans that often can't be found elsewhere, such as O'Brien or Clodagh. Their Ancient and Modern colours are very appealing, although I wish they would make stock Reproduction (Weathered) K/1! Dalgliesh's main specialty remains dance tartans. They have a large range available in lightweight K/7, many setts which are in-house creations.

Lochcarron: They has a very extensive range for heavyweight (Strome) cloth, which means that, more often than not, this is what many kilts will be made from, whether they are a low-yardage style or a full "tank". Whenever I order Strome cloth, I have no idea what the selvedge will be. Occasionally I get a traditional kilting selvedge, but most of the time it will be a tuck-in. Sometimes this tuck-in selvedge is really great, other times it is on par, or worse, than Marton Mills. I hardly ever work with Braeriach (Mediumweight), but it is much the same. The colours of any of their ranges are quite nice, especially the Weathered, but the Ancient is not as nice as Strathmore, but better than the House of Edgar.

House of Edgar: They have a large Medium weight range most of which is available in single-width with a traditional selvedge, except for the Hebridean and shadow tartans which are double-width with a tuck-in selvedge. Their Old & Rare range contains many tartans or unusual historic variants of tartans which just aren't found anywhere else. Their small Heavyweight range is divided into two categories: Heavyweight which sold single-width with a traditional selvedge, and Nevis which is their budget range with a tuck-in selvedge and stain-resistant coating. I don't think their Ancient range is very nice-looking; the Ancient Red tends to look pink and the Ancient Green looks a bit too 'mint-green', but their Modern or Muted palettes are very attractive.

Strathmore: Strathmore only carries light (T7) and medium weight (W60). The mediumweight has a fairly good selvedge which can sometimes be tuck-in or occasionally traditional. Very nice colours, especially the Wilson's of Bannockburn reproductions. I think their Ancient Colour palette (or 'Old Colours' as they term it) is better than anyone else's.

Marton Mills: Their fabric always has a tuck-in selvedge which seems to get better in quality each year. It is also treated for stain-resistance. Their heavyweight Jura range, in particular, is a very good value for money and is quite similar to HoE's Nevis. Their Modern colours are nice, but the Ancient can be a bit too light depending upon the tartan. They produce the best-looking shade of Saffron, though the colours of some their other Irish County Crest tartans can be a bit garish.

Fraser & Kirkbright: A light feeling fabric with a very soft hand. The selvedge is not only fuzzy, but also very wavy. These fuzzy bits can easily be cleaned up by using a clothes shaver, but the wavy edge can't be so easily fixed and pressing can sometimes make it look worse. This can look bad on the apron portions of a kilt. I never use F&K simply because they don't carry medium or heavyweight in stock.

So, while they are all good fabrics, whenever I am making a 13 oz. kilt I will try to use the House of Edgar or Strathmore. When I am making a 16 oz. kilt I will first try Dalgliesh, then House of Edgar, then Marton Mills, then lastly Lochcarron. (I realise this somewhat contradicts the OP's quote concerning my website, but I have become increasingly disappointed with Lochcarron of late.)

[ForresterModern]

One minor comment on Slohairt's post about Strathmore; Their standard stock is 13 oz W60 or the lighter T7, but they do make a 15-16oz W100 series that is a custom run, available in any of the W60 tartans. My Forrester Hunting is in that weight and is fantastic fabric, rivalled only by my 16oz Dalgleish for finish and hand. I got lucky wehn I ordered some W60 in that tartan and it was out of stock, but they had some W100 available and I got it at the same price, a real steal IMHO. Unfortunately they only do custom order runs in this weight in 30 meter DW lengths or more, so I find after doing some searching on their site.