Full wrap utility kilt

[Steelkilt]

Good evening gents,

I’m looking for a step up from my Utkilts in terms of materials used and build quality. My main concern is the underapron, and how much coverage it provides. I’m looking mainly at Stumptown and Utilikilt products, but am open to suggestion. My “wish list” (in addition to the full wrap) would be:
- deep pleats
- sturdy material (duck cloth- prone to wrinkling and holding odd shapes?)
- Heavy enough material not to be blown all over by the wind (kiltlifter is fine for the name of a beer, less fine when in public

Thanks in advance!

[Steve Ashton]

I guess I am just a bit confused what you are asking.

The title says "Full wrap utility kilt" and yet you give two kilts as examples that are not full wrap. Or perhaps I am misunderstanding what you mean.

Then you say you are looking for a step up from one brand and yet give that same brand as an example of what you are looking for.

Then you say you want deep pleats. Pleat depth is a function of the amount of fabric and the size of hips that fabric must go around.
Then you say you want sturdy material but say duck canvas because I can only assume that it wrinkles and you seem to want it to hold odd shapes.

I hope you can see where the confusion lies.

Perhaps you may wish to edit the wording of your post to make your wishes a little clearer and more easily understood.

[Tobus]

If you're looking for a kilt with more of a complete under-apron, deeper pleats, and resistance against wind blowing the pleats, I would probably not recommend a Utilikilt. The narrow inner apron is one of my biggest complaints about my Utilikilt (Workman model in my case; it may be different with others). The inner apron is only long enough to reach where the V-pattern of snaps connects it to the outer apron, which lies on the front of my left leg. When I walk or sit, the edge of the inner apron drifts to the inside of my leg. It's a bit annoying. The pleats are not deep at all by kilt standards, and the duck-cloth material just doesn't have any swish or movement to it. They stitch all the folds in the pleats, and that makes it even stiffer against swishing. But it is very durable, and the stitching keeps the pleats well-defined without ever having to worry about needing to press the pleats back into shape. I haven't found wrinkling to be a major issue, either.

[Steelkilt]

I’ll try to clarify my questions by replying in red

I guess I am just a bit confused what you are asking.

The title says "Full wrap utility kilt" and yet you give two kilts as examples that are not full wrap. Or perhaps I am misunderstanding what you mean.
Thank you for asking for clarity, it was a late post! I’m unfamiliar with the Stumptown and Utilikilt products, and I’d like to know if either brand provides a full wrap underkilt.
Then you say you are looking for a step up from one brand and yet give that same brand as an example of what you are looking for.
I’m familiar with only the Utkilts products, but I’m asking if any other maker uses better materials and construction practices to produce a superior product.

Then you say you want deep pleats. Pleat depth is a function of the amount of fabric and the size of hips that fabric must go around.
Then you say you want sturdy material but say duck canvas because I can only assume that it wrinkles and you seem to want it to hold odd shapes.
Pleat depth: Any maker that has deep pleats in utility kilts? I understand that there may be some variation in experience, but makers who are known to use enough fabric to produce deep pleats? My query into duck fabric is based on my concern (not desire for) that the fabric may be so stiff as to balloon and wrinkle terribly. Is this a common reality?

Thank you for helping me clarify!

I hope you can see where the confusion lies
——————————————————————-

Perhaps you may wish to edit the wording of your post to make your wishes a little clearer and more easily understood.

[Steelkilt]

Thank you, I’ll avoid the Workman and it’s narrow underapron! Good to know it doesn’t wrinkle too badly though!

If you're looking for a kilt with more of a complete under-apron, deeper pleats, and resistance against wind blowing the pleats, I would probably not recommend a Utilikilt. The narrow inner apron is one of my biggest complaints about my Utilikilt (Workman model in my case; it may be different with others). The inner apron is only long enough to reach where the V-pattern of snaps connects it to the outer apron, which lies on the front of my left leg. When I walk or sit, the edge of the inner apron drifts to the inside of my leg. It's a bit annoying. The pleats are not deep at all by kilt standards, and the duck-cloth material just doesn't have any swish or movement to it. They stitch all the folds in the pleats, and that makes it even stiffer against swishing. But it is very durable, and the stitching keeps the pleats well-defined without ever having to worry about needing to press the pleats back into shape. I haven't found wrinkling to be a major issue, either.

[Taskr]

Sounds like a Freedom PV or USAK PV kilt to me

[Steelkilt]

Thank you for the feedback so far! Am I correct to assume that my list is not a reality among utility kilts?

[ratspike]

For something off the rack, yes. You'll need to have it made for you. Freedom Kilts is the only option I know of.

[The Wizard of BC]

Of course Marton Mills weaves solid color Poly/Rayon fabrics. They are primarily suppliers of fabrics for military and police uniforms and for academic robes and school uniforms.

The line of solid colored fabrics, woven in the same 2x2 Twill using the same yarns at the Tartan line, is called York. Any color found in one of the Tartan (Balmoral line) fabrics can be found in the York line.

The Polyester/Rayon fabrics woven by Marton Mills will not ignite nor melt to your skin. The fabric is self extinguishing and leaves an ash behind if exposed to direct flame. A cigarette burn leaves only a small, self sealing hole.

These fabrics are also Teflon coated to resist stains and, if pressed under the correct temperature, any creases will be almost permanent even after machine washing and drying.

There seems to be a bit of misunderstanding about terms and construction techniques. Let me see if I can explain.

The first garments in what we call the "Utility style" were made by the Utilikilt company of Seattle, WA USA. Designed by Steven Villegas, these were the first of the modern garments to use an old Reverse Kinguisse pleating style. Within a very short time there were literally hundreds of companies offering copies and outright knockoffs.
The Utilikilt was also the first garment to use a narrow (7") front apron. The original Utilikilt had a zipper front fly like the Cargo shorts from which they were born.
The "V" pattern of snaps on the front aprons was to give visual accent to the garment that was not worn with a sporran.
I can remember sitting with Steven one day and he strongly objected to the use of the word kilt to describe his product. He prefers the term MUG which stands for Male Un-Bifercated Garment. Steven denied that his product had any Scottish influence. He stated that the only reason the last for letters of the company name were KILT is because he well knew that he would never sell a product called a Utiliskirt.

Today the primary characteristic of the Utility style garments is not the pleats or the apron width or the pockets. It is how they are made. These garments are made like blue jeans. The overall strength of the garment comes from the strength of the fabric and the stitching. We call this construction "jeans made" vs the construction of an iconic kilt which is "kilt made".

Most of the Utility style garments use very little fabric. For example my personal Utilikilt (the prototype of the Survivor model) has only 2.3 linear yards of fabric.

When a kilt is made the amount of fabric is usually much more. We call the Iconic kilt an 8 yard kilt but the actual amount of fabric can vary dependent on the size of the Tartan, the hip circumference it needs to go around, and how the kilt is pleated.

An iconic kilt has distinctive front aprons which are usually slightly more than 1/2 of the wearers waist circumference. Some of the modern garments may have aprons of almost any width and shape imaginable. I have seen aprons which are 1/3 of the waist, The Stumptown company taper their aprons wider at the waist and narrow at the bottom.
It is usual for there to be two overlapping aprons with the under apron the same width as the outer apron. This would usually mean that a 7 inch wide apron would have a 7 inch under apron and overlap 7 inches. An iconic kilt for a guy with a waist of say 34 would have aprons of about 17 to 20 inches wide and would therefore overlap 17 to 20 inches.

So - What does this all mean?

Well, if you prefer the very wide and shallow pleats usually found on the Utility style or MUG's, if you prefer the Reverse Kiltguisse style of pleating, if you prefer the narrow aprons, if you prefer cargo pockets, and if you prefer to wear your kilt down where you wear blue jeans - then you would select one of the Utility (MUG) style garments.

If you prefer a wider apron with more overlap, if you prefer narrower or deeper pleats, if you prefer a garment that exhibits the famous swish then you would select one of the more iconic styles.

The fabric the garment is made from - the width and depth of the pleats, and how much overlap there is in the aprons is dependent on the maker.

There is one other factor which you should note. Many of the Utility style garments are mass produced. Some like the Utilikilt by many different sub-contractors much like an assembly line and some like UTKilts, and others which are often found on EBay, in Sailkot, Pakistan. With these garments you are basically buying "off-the-rack'.

Some makers like USA Kilts and Freedom Kilts are actual kiltmakers. You can call us and talk directly to the person who will make your kilt. Those who actually make the items they sell have the advantage that you can ask for almost anything your mind can imagine. It is up to us to make it for you.

[Steelkilt]

Thank you all for the great info and insight, I’ll have to start putting money aside for the (now) combined dreams of a custom kilt and a full wrap utility kilt!