Texas Annexation Discussion

[Wolfhawk]

In another topic which got hijacked and closed (which I was part of the hijacking. I am sorry for that) I stated:

I think one of the reasons that the Scots used Texas as one of their 'stopping points' was the fierce loyalty that Texans have for each other and the state; so much so that the idea that Texas can break away from the Union has cropped up several times in the years since Texas became part of the Union. Based off the reported text that involved the speech that Sam Houston made in Salido Texas from the Stage Coach Inn balcony where he supposedly said that if we must leave the union, then we should become a Republic again - the reason? Texas has a history of being a place that was a little beyond and above the rest of the Union. During the 'Tea Party' action around April 15th 2009, our Governor mentioned the idea that maybe Texas needs to look at applying its right to leave the Union to become a Republic again. Why? Because Texas has too much 'wild blood' in it and at sometime they will try and take the reins again to control their own lives. I feel like this is the way the Scots sometime feel. I am reading a HUGH book on Scotland and I can see where this runs deep in the veins of some over 'across the pond.'

I have strong feelings about two places in my history - Texas and Scotland. Outside that, I do not have as strong feelings about any other places. It was mentioned one time that most people feel like they are Americans first and 'whatever state' second. Here in Texas, that is the opposite. I know quite a few people who if they were made to choose whether they would lose this Citizen-hood in one of the other, would keep the Texas one. Can many states make this claim? Do not the Scots feel this way? Does this desire not burn under their skin?

I also stated:

The reason (in my understanding) that Texas was enticed to join the Union was the problem of Mexico. Once that problem was removed, the need to the unions protection was not as paramount, as Texas was now stronger and able handle their problem better. There are questions about the legality of the US to pass a resolution to annex Texas anyway.

Cajunscot stated:

I'm not sure we can say Texas was "enticed" to join the Union, as many Texicans, including Houston, actively sought statehood before 1845. Even after the Mexican problem was gone, there was still the issue of Commanches and other Native Americans, especially with the beginning of the Civil War and the withdrawl of Federal forces. The Texans not only had to send troops to support Richmond, they also had to deal with the Native American problem on the Western frontier.

What questions specifically were there in regards to Texas annexation? Are you referring to the concern of Northern Whigs, who were against the annexation because of the concern over the expansion of slavery?
My Scottish ancestors were loyal Union men, who fought for their adopted country and state (Iowa), as did many Scottish immigrants.

I am very proud of my Iowa and Arizona heritage, but I am an American citizen first.

[Wolfhawk]

I do not questions that we had a lot in our backyard with the problem with Mexico and the Comanches and other Indian tribes.

If Texas had become full-circle and back into a Republic then they would have been stronger and in a better position to handle these problems. A lot of the problems were being handled by the Texas Rangers, anyway.

The enticing remark:
I have no doubt there were many people who wanted to get Texas into the Union when it was first founded. I have no doubt that there were many people who wanted Texas in the union when it became a Republic. I do not feel this was a major feeling by the time that the Civil War was breaking out. At this time, there were three feelings in Texas - stay with the union (very low level of people), join the South (more people in this area), and become a Republic again (lots in this area, but this was not offered as an option when the secession discussions were going on)

I do not doubt that there were Scots in union states who backed the union. There were Texans who backed the union here but they did not do well once Texas joined the South. Texas did not have a strong slave population so the reason for Texas joining the South was overwhelmingly about state rights.

The question of legality of the annexation of Texas:
Texas lost a lot of land during the Republic/union transition - all of New Mexico, most of Colorado, and a part of Wyoming. The ability of the union to annex land was based off territories, not nations. Texas was a sovereign nation and had ambassadors in other lands.

[Woodsheal]

Many constitutional scholars believe the individual "sovereign" states have the constitutional right to secede from the Federal union if they deem it in their best interests. Others believe Mr Lincoln settled that question once and for all.

In either case, I see this thread going nowhere fast...!

[Panache]

To All,

When the Moderators close a discussion it is not good form to immediately start another thread to continue it.

If you wish to discuss this matter further the Mod Squad suggests taking it to the PM system for discussion for those wishing to continue it.

With this we close this thread

Respectfully

Jamie and the Mod Squad