Difference between Irish and Scot Gaelic

[Kent Frazier]

Wow, the first post in this form!

I'm curious as to what differences there are in Irish and Scot Gaelic. I was looking for a moniker to use on some other forums. Using what I thought was an online English to Scot Gaelic dictionary I found "dionadair". Which was/is suppose to mean "protector". When I looked up "dionadair" other places were saying it was Irish?

[Old Hippie]

I'm curious as to what differences there are in Irish and Scot Gaelic.

I used to fence with a guy from Ireland, when I lived in Iowa. Occasionally we'd try out bits of The Gaelic on each other -- he learnt his Irish Gaelic at the point of a nun's ruler, I have picked up a few phrases of Scottish Gaelic here and there. We found that we were unable to communicate. His wife was Italian; she understood neither of us.

He told me that in Ireland they say they speak Gaelic and the Scots speak "Erse", while the Scots I asked say that they speak Gaelic and the Irish speak "Irish."

That may not be helpful, but may define the scope of the question.

[EagleJCS]

From my limited understanding (and I speak neither of the twa), they are in the same language family, but there are enough differences in usage, vocabulary and pronunciation that the two are quite distinct - like Spanish and Italian are in the same family with each other, but they are different enough to be mutually unintelligble.

I have read that, given enough time, patience and a broad enough vocabulary, speakers of each form of Gaelic could garner a limited understanding of basic phrases, but not really enough to hold an in-depth conversation.

[Oldhiker]

Gaelic Language is divided into two major groups
Goidelic - Irish (Gaeilge), Scottish Gaelic (Gàidhlig), and Manx (Gaelg).
&
Brythonic - Welsh, Cornish, Breton

All the above are Celtic languages that migrated at different times to what is now Ireland and England.

I am just starting my Scottish Gaelic lessons and having a ball. Just now starting to see some of the similarities.
hope this helps

[Old Hippie]

I am just starting my Scottish Gaelic lessons and having a ball.

Where are you taking lessons? I've been thinking about trying to get a little more organized. Was looking at the online series from Sabhal Mor Ostaig...

I know myself well enough as a learner to know I need externally-set benchmarks to hit. Otherwise I'll give it over eventually.

:ootd:

[OC Richard]

The relationship between Scottish Gaelic and Irish is sort of like that between English and German: the core vocabulary is very similar, but there have been enough changes to make them be regarded as distinct languages.

About what to call these languages, "Irish" is the politically correct term when speaking English. "Erse" is regarded as somewhat pejorative. "Gaelic" should be reserved for Scottish Gaelic.

In Celtic: A Comparitive Study D B Gregor says:

...the family of Celtic languages consists of two branches according as they kept original Indo-European Q (Goidelic) or changed it to P (Brythonic) : e.g. the word for four: I-E kwetuor, Latin quattuor, Irish ceathair, Gaelic ceithir, Manx kiare, but Welsh pedwar, Cornish peswar, Breton peder.

In the same book is a passage for comparison. Here's one part, in Irish, then Scots Gaelic. Sorry I don't know how to do the accent marks. They're one of the things that makes Scots Gaelic look so different from Irish.

Irish:
20. Agus is iad seo iad i n-ar cuireadh an siol san talamh mhaith, an lucht a chluin an briathar, a ghlacas e agus a bheir toradh uatha, duine fa dheich ar fhichich, duine fa thri fhichidh, agus duine fa chead.

Scots Gaelic:
20. Agus is iad so iadsan a chuireadh ann an talamh maith; an dream a chluinneas am focal, agus a ghabhas e, agus a bheir a mach toradh, cuid a dheich thar fhicead uiread, cuid a thri ficead uiread, agus cuid a cheud uiread as a chuireadh.

[Eric Schutte]

Hello all,

I am hoping to get to the Clan MacLean gathering in Mull in 2012 and I really want at least a few words down before I go so.......anyone want to write back and forth in Scots Gaelic?

Thanks guys,

Eric Schutte

[Arlen]

Think of it this way, it's like the difference between Spanish speakers in Spain and things like Spanish in South America and Portuguese.
They come from the same linguistic route and they can just about understand each other, but to people in the know they don't actually sound anything alike.

[ciltmore]

It is my understanding that Scots Gaelic and Irish Gaelic were pretty well seperated and distinguishable by about 1700. I read that somewhere, don't ask me where...
I also read that Gaidhlig has more Norse words, (of course) and that these words involve commerce and sea travel.
I found "Happy Birthday Song" in Gáidhlig on the internet but can't find it now...
Meal do neaithuich(sp?) an diugh
Sing this over and over, like "Happy Birthday to you" It translates as (I believe): Sweet (is) your birth(sp) today...

It was really cute as they had an MP3 of children singing it!

I have Teach Yourself Gaelic, MacLaren's Gaelic and a big ol G-E, E-G Dictionary (MacLennan) as well as Renton & MacDonald's Pocket(?) Dictionary as well as Grámar Na Gáidhlig (Michel Byrne) and...the coolest f*****g thing, an Etymological Dictionary of Scottish Gaelic (Alexander MacBain) which I originally found at the local library :-)

Problem?- No one to talk to locally....
I'm not too bad at reading real simple stuff but my ear for the language is terrible

Here are some internet learning programs:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/scotland/alba/f...an/index.shtml

http://www.bbc.co.uk/scotland/alba/f...id/index.shtml

http://www.bbc.co.uk/alba/foghlam/beag_air_bheag/

http://www.bbc.co.uk/scotland/colinandcumberland/

Dictionaries, etc...

http://www.yourdictionary.com/langua....html#goidelic

http://www.rampantscotland.com/gaelic.htm

http://www.websters-online-dictionar...lation/Gaelic/

http://www2.smo.uhi.ac.uk/gaidhlig/faclair/bb/lorg.php

http://www.ceantar.org/Dicts/MB2/index.html

http://www.bbc.co.uk/scotland/alba/n...cail/?letter=a

(BBC Alba learning and Gaidhlig only news, etc. is pretty cool because some words are actually highlighted and will give an English definition when you put the cursor over it.)










And now I leave you with a poem I wrote, warning about the absence of the tongue...please excuse my bad Gáidhlig, and no, I like the English, being part myself...
This poem is about the loss of the Celtic languages ...How thoughts and ideas are stolen from a people when they lose their own language. The kiss is the acqusition of a foreign language and its ideas of decorum.





A' Phog as an Allmharach


A' Phog as an Allmharach

Oir chi Seanair agus Seanmhair:

Cha bhi aithne aca na leanai
An teanga de
***********Gaisgeach
***********Filidh
***********Fir Naomh
***********Mna Glicas
as am bliadhnaichean sin chaidh

Bith an Og seo a fuirich sna Tir
agus
Cha dean iad mol nam mathraichean

Chi iad mol airson a mhathair
agus cha bhi pogach nam mnathan




The Kiss from the Stranger

The Kiss From the Stranger

For Grandfather and Grandmother will see:

The children will not know
The tongue of
***********Warrior
***********Poet
***********Holy Man
***********Wise Woman
from the years past

These Young will be living in the Land
and
They will not make praise to the mothers

They will see pebble strewn beaches for their mother
and the women give up their kissing habits

[Eric Schutte]

Ciltmore,

Thu ma dith do dean comhradh, tha mi deiseil, mo caraidh!

Eric Schutte