5-lobe cantles c1860 America

[OC Richard]

The timeline of the Muirhead sporran, 1854, makes it a quite possible candidate for the inspiration of the 79th NY's sporrans, the regiment being raised in 1858.

Thing is, the overall shape of the Muirhead cantle is exactly like the 79th NY cantles. The only difference is the central point of the Muirhead is changed to a lobe on the 79th NY.

Perhaps the Muirhead was incorrectly copied?

On closer inspection, one of the photos I posted above appears to also show a central point, and another is unclear.

So, the Muirhead sporran might have been copied by various New York makers with varying degrees of accuracy.

[artificer]

The timeline of the Muirhead sporran, 1854, makes it a quite possible candidate for the inspiration of the 79th NY's sporrans, the regiment being raised in 1858.

Thing is, the overall shape of the Muirhead cantle is exactly like the 79th NY cantles. The only difference is the central point of the Muirhead is changed to a lobe on the 79th NY.

Perhaps the Muirhead was incorrectly copied?

On closer inspection, one of the photos I posted above appears to also show a central point, and another is unclear.

So, the Muirhead sporran might have been copied by various New York makers with varying degrees of accuracy.

I think we have to be careful to avoid a "Correlation does not imply causation" situation here. It's easy to connect apparent dots, ignoring the 150 some-odd years in between and all the small situations which could have given the 79th their sporran. According to a paper Matt wrote William Muirhead died in 1911 in Washington D.C., so it's not out of the realm of possibility that his particular single example was the genesis of the 79ths design. That said, I think it's probably at least equally likely that another similar sporran was the originator of the design, none others of which survived the test of time- being rather lumpen and less graceful than many Victorian era sporrans, and lacking a metal cantle which might make holding onto an old moth-eaten family piece more likely.

Again, not saying it's not the case, certain time frames and locales to sort of meet up, just saying we have to avoid possibly erroneously connecting dots which APPEAR to join up but may not.

ith:

[OC Richard]

Give the dazzling variety of cantle designs seen in The Highlander Of Scotland, dating to nearly the same time, and given that the same cantle design appears over and over in New York in the 1850s and 1860s, yet not elsewhere, the suggestion presents itself that a single original might have served as the inspiration for a number of New York sporrans, or that New Yorkers were purchasing sporrans from a single maker, perhaps local, perhaps back in Scotland.

[artificer]

Give the dazzling variety of cantle designs seen in The Highlander Of Scotland, dating to nearly the same time, and given that the same cantle design appears over and over in New York in the 1850s and 1860s, yet not elsewhere, the suggestion presents itself that a single original might have served as the inspiration for a number of New York sporrans, or that New Yorkers were purchasing sporrans from a single maker, perhaps local, perhaps back in Scotland.

I agree wholeheartedly, OC Richard, and speculated as much in my first posting-

I'm not a Civil War historian, but my guess would be someone had a Scottish sporran of similar design that ended up being the prototype for the 79th,
and then, because that was the style that was most commonly seen (having been produced in at least 4 companies worth of volume) it sort of became the
de facto "sporran shape" for the New York area.

My point of contention would be pointing directly to the Muirhead sporran as the originator of the 79ths design.
Not that it isn't a possibility, but without establishing WHERE Muirhead came into the US (was it Boston, NYC?, further south?) and when/if he was ever in the NY area it seems like
folly to assign the design DIRECTLY to his piece.

What we DO have is direct-line evidence that this general cantle shape WAS made in Scotland (at least the one of them ), even if it doesn't appear in photographs IN Scotland at the time.

Given that we know many commercial Scottish makers made plenty of pieces off the same pattern it's not out of the realm of possibility to assume that there was more than one other sporran in a similar shape.
The potential 'gotcha' exception would be if the Muirhead piece were made as a one-off by someone who was commissioned to make a one-off piece for Mr. Muirhead (or his father/grandfather, etc) and
then this maker never made another. Odds aren't great for that particular scenario, but it IS possible.

I'd be reluctant to assign the 79ths design DIRECTLY on Muirhead's sporran without some corroborating facts about Mr. Muirheads possibly being in New York.

Given the oddities of the rest of the 79th's domestically made gear I'd assume that the sporrans were made locally as well rather than imported.

ith:

[OC Richard]

I do wonder if we KNOW that the Muirhead sporran was made in Scotland, or (like many things in museums) the story is one traditionally associated with the artifact, but in fact not verifiable.

There could have been a single New York maker responsible for all of this type, or a single Scottish maker that happened to be known over here, either by individuals or perhaps by an importer such as a specialised New York clothier.

Yes the 79th NY sporrans could have been made by the same source, or copied from a sample from that source. I have read that the fabric for the 79th NY's kilts and trews was imported from Scotland, but I get the impression that nearly everything else was locally made.

After the war it was different, with several items of the 79th NY's post-war uniform being imported from Scotland, and therefore looking like typical Scottish items (hose-tops, spats, sporrans, Glengarries) rather than the unique designs of the pre-war uniform.

In my opinion the pre-war 1858-1861 Full Dress uniform of the 79th NY stands out as one of the most fascinating and odd chapters in the history of Highland Dress.