Jacobite era tartans still in use today

[OC Richard]

What about Drummond of Perth? How far back does that design go?

Thanks for the list. It's pretty cool.

A few of those appear in 18th century portraits which are familiar to me. It would be nice to have the tartans sorted by source

1) taken from a portrait painted prior to 1746

2) taken from a piece of surviving cloth known to date to before 1746

3) ?? what other specific sources of tartan designs exist? Pre-1746 thread counts written down by a weaver?

[CMcG]

Interesting! figheadair, could you give us some details on the MacQuarrie tartan being dated to mid-18th century? The references in the Scottish Register of Tartans don't seem to go back further than early 19th.

[figheadair]

Interesting! figheadair, could you give us some details on the MacQuarrie tartan being dated to mid-18th century? The references in the Scottish Register of Tartans don't seem to go back further than early 19th.

Both the Cockburn (1810) and Highland Society of London (1816) collections contain samples of MacQuarrie, not those generally worn today, that are pieces typical of rural woven cloth rather than Wilsons' material which makes up the majority of both collections. The patterns differ but in both cases the rustic specimens are woven with hand-spun singles (non-plied yarn) and have herringbone selvedges. The material and setting in both specimens is consistent with Highland cloth of the mid-18th century hence their inclusion in my list. Here's the HSL specimen.

[CMcG]

Both the Cockburn (1810) and Highland Society of London (1816) collections contain samples of MacQuarrie, not those generally worn today, that are pieces typical of rural woven cloth rather than Wilsons' material which makes up the majority of both collections. The patterns differ but in both cases the rustic specimens are woven with hand-spun singles (non-plied yarn) and have herringbone selvedges. The material and setting in both specimens is consistent with Highland cloth of the mid-18th century hence their inclusion in my list. Here's the HSL specimen.

That's some deep tartan knowledge. After looking up those sources it appears that in the early 1800s, the Highland Society of London (of which Cockburn was a member), actually went to the clan chiefs and asked what their tartan was. The last chief of the Clan MacQuarrie died in 1818 and, the chiefdom having been vacant for nearly 200 years, this is an important historical point for clansmen. The most commonly seen MacQuarrie tartan is actually quite different from the one authorized by the last chief.

[figheadair]

That's some deep tartan knowledge. After looking up those sources it appears that in the early 1800s, the Highland Society of London (of which Cockburn was a member), actually went to the clan chiefs and asked what their tartan was. The last chief of the Clan MacQuarrie died in 1818 and, the chiefdom having been vacant for nearly 200 years, this is an important historical point for clansmen. The most commonly seen MacQuarrie tartan is actually quite different from the one authorized by the last chief.

Gen. David Stewart of Garth was the driver to gather the Society's tartan collection. He was taken by the idea of clan tartans even though he and the majority of chiefs had no idea of what they wore in the 18th century. As a result, many chiefs went to Wilsons to ask them what they should be wearing. Wilsons' comments on a number of tartans supports the recent adoption of tartans by particular clans. The MacQuarrie sample is one of a very small number that were gathered in the Highlands rather than supplied by a commercial weaving firm..

[Tarheel]

This thread peaked my interest in the Colquhoun tartan. I found this site: http://www.helensburgh-heritage.co.u...ons&Itemid=461

I don't see any mention of a surviving swatch but the story was compelling enough to post.

[figheadair]

This thread peaked my interest in the Colquhoun tartan. I found this site: http://www.helensburgh-heritage.co.u...ons&Itemid=461

I don't see any mention of a surviving swatch but the story was compelling enough to post.

An interesting article. I know the author; we agree on some things but not others; I'm driven by evidence. This is the key phrase ". The pattern was listed with Wilsons as “superfine” and was therefore likely to have been regarded as a clan tartan prior to the end of the eighteenth century."

Superfine was a quality of cloth woven by Wilsons of Bannockburn c1800-40. Wilsons gave no evidence to support the idea that they regarded thks a clan tartan. The author of the article believes that there clan tartans in the mid-18th century; an idea I fundanemtally disagree with. There is no evidence for the Colquhoun tartan before c1800.

[CMcG]

Gen. David Stewart of Garth was the driver to gather the Society's tartan collection. He was taken by the idea of clan tartans even though he and the majority of chiefs had no idea of what they wore in the 18th century. As a result, many chiefs went to Wilsons to ask them what they should be wearing. Wilsons' comments on a number of tartans supports the recent adoption of tartans by particular clans. The MacQuarrie sample is one of a very small number that were gathered in the Highlands rather than supplied by a commercial weaving firm..

Yes, I've heard about the rush for chiefs to get a clan tartan, particularly before King George IV's big visit to Scotland in 1822. Sort of like a gold rush, but with tartan—everybody racing to stake their claim. It is ironic that a majority of chiefs didn't know what their clan tartan was and had to ask the weavers, but amazing how powerful the idea was and how strongly people have held on to it.

It is very cool to find out that the HSL MacQuarrie sample came from a rural, Highland source. I wear the more common MacQuarrie, but now I've got a serious hankering for the Jacobite era version! Matt Newsome has a MacQuarrie kilt in the Cockburn sett, which appears to be quite similar to the HSL sample, but not quite the same.

My MacQuarrie modern:



Matt's Cockburn collection MacQuarrie:

[OC Richard]

It would be nice to have a gallery of all the 18th century portraits which have been mined for tartans that are currently woven.

I'll make a little start...

The green/green/white MacDonald (I saw about 30 kilts in this tartan yesterday... it's worn by a local youth pipe band)



There are, what, four different red tartans in this painting? How many have been reconstructed from the painting and woven?



The Piper to the Laird of Grant. Has this tartan been woven? That light red looks like binding.



The Champion.

[figheadair]

What about Drummond of Perth? How far back does that design go?

Thanks for the list. It's pretty cool.

A few of those appear in 18th century portraits which are familiar to me. It would be nice to have the tartans sorted by source

1) taken from a portrait painted prior to 1746

2) taken from a piece of surviving cloth known to date to before 1746

3) ?? what other specific sources of tartan designs exist? Pre-1746 thread counts written down by a weaver?

Richard, the Drummond of Perth was a Wilsons' pattern and cannot be dated earlier than c1775; see my paper of the Stewart of Fingask for more info.

I have the list in Excel which means that it is a simple task to reank them according to your 1 and 2 but I would broaden 1 to c1765 which would include the early Proscription period but before Wilsons got going.

Before c1775 there are no other sources of tartan records other than those in groups 1 and 2. There are certainly no known weaver's records until Wilsons' from the latye 1700s.