when to wear a belt and when not to

**Jock Scot** · 3rd October 15, 10:56 AM

You are quite correct that "normally" if one wears a waistcoat then one does not wear a kilt belt. However I can think of one very traditional Laird who commonly wears a kilt belt over his waistcoat with day wear. One also needs to remember that with some forms of evening(dress) jackets the belt is worn either over the waistcoat, or jacket itself depending on cut and style. In this mode I think that the belt is really considered as a dirk belt. As dirks are rarely carried these days one could argue that the belt could be dispensed with. Nevertheless, there are certain dress jackets where the belt is an effective addition.

In passing, it is traditional to wear a "prong" style belt buckle on the kilt belt for daywear and a "plate" style buckle for evening wear. I know some of our trans-Atlantic friends may cough a bit at that, but traditionaly that is how it is done.

**The Wizard of BC** · 3rd October 15, 12:16 PM

When I was growing up I was taught that if you are wearing a vest you do not wear a belt. Even if you happen to be wearing trousers. That is what braces are for.

As the belt worn with a kilt is decorative and not used to hold the kilt up, it serves only to give a visual break between kilt and shirt.

But all over the web you will see pictures of guys with both belt and vest. Personally I don't like the look of a buckle peeking out underneath my vest so do not wear a belt if I am wearing a jacket and vest.

**Bruce Scott** · 3rd October 15, 03:33 PM

Originally Posted by Jock Scot

In passing, it is traditional to wear a "prong" style belt buckle on the kilt belt for daywear and a "plate" style buckle for evening wear. I know some of our trans-Atlantic friends may cough a bit at that, but traditionaly that is how it is done.

While I'm sure that you are correct, these gentlemen are all wearing plate buckles with day wear. Many would probably look to their clan chiefs for guidance on dress.
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**Jock Scot** · 4th October 15, 02:44 AM

Originally Posted by Bruce Scott

While I'm sure that you are correct, these gentlemen are all wearing plate buckles with day wear. Many would probably look to their clan chiefs for guidance on dress.

I doubt that many would look at their Clan Chiefs attire for guidance , other than a passing interest and that would go for most kilted gentlemen who take a "20 yard blink of the eye" glance at any kilted soul that passes by. Plate buckles are indeed worn by some, not just a Laird, but that is regarded as one of those personal flair things, rather like the chap who wears his belt over his waistcoat, he likes it so who are we to criticise? Well, of course we are not, we are making observations, but the trouble is with observations , we are unlikely to know the reasoning behind the end result in the picture.

In passing, I note that most kilt hire companies seem to equip their customers with plate style buckles and show the models wearing the belt under the waistcoat. Neither is a hanging offence, but hardly traditional etiquette as per the OP's question.

**tpa** · 15th October 15, 01:01 PM

Originally Posted by Jock Scot

In passing, I note that most kilt hire companies seem to equip their customers with plate style buckles and show the models wearing the belt under the waistcoat. Neither is a hanging offence, but hardly traditional etiquette as per the OP's question.

I have seen that down here on shop dummies in wedding hire shops too Jock; on questioning the response is that the the outfits are sourced from Scotland and that is how they come! Their saving grace is that at least they have dressed the dummies with the pleats at the back. Presumably the outfits come with instructions.

**saditch** · 4th October 15, 03:34 AM

Originally Posted by Bruce Scott

While I'm sure that you are correct, these gentlemen are all wearing plate buckles with day wear. Many would probably look to their clan chiefs for guidance on dress.
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Hi Bruce, love the pics, I note in photo 3 we have three gentlemen, one of whom is wearing both waistcoat AND belt & buckle. i guess the premise appears to be that "tradition" says they don't go together and dare i say aesthetically it doesn't work, I personally don't think it works simply because the plate buckle gets hidden by the waistcoat. but hey, thankfully we are all different, with different views & opinions ( if we didn't we wouldn't have a forum !! btw forgive my ignorance what is a "prong" sorry for being thick :-(

**WillowEstate** · 4th October 15, 11:11 AM

Originally Posted by saditch

Hi Bruce, love the pics, I note in photo 3 we have three gentlemen, one of whom is wearing both waistcoat AND belt & buckle. i guess the premise appears to be that "tradition" says they don't go together and dare i say aesthetically it doesn't work, I personally don't think it works simply because the plate buckle gets hidden by the waistcoat. but hey, thankfully we are all different, with different views & opinions ( if we didn't we wouldn't have a forum !! btw forgive my ignorance what is a "prong" sorry for being thick :-(

The guy in the middle in picture three is wearing what I understand a prong belt to be, not sure what others might call it, "hasp" maybe? It's the pin-like thing that comes forward through the belt and rests on the leading edge of the buckle to hold it.

P.S. there are no "thick" questions here, if you need to know, just ask, someone will respond.

**carlisle401** · 15th October 15, 10:13 AM

I think you will find that a lot of people do wear belts with kilts. The Scottish regiments did not not wear belts with waistcoats (vests). I believe this is where it started. The officer here must be Duty Officer hence, the Glengarry.

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**OC Richard** · 16th October 15, 04:12 AM

Originally Posted by carlisle401

I think you will find that a lot of people do wear belts with kilts. The Scottish regiments did not wear belts with waistcoats (vests).

Nor did Scottish civilians.

I have a large collection of vintage photos of men in Highland Dress and not a single one has a belt visible under the waistcoat. The photographic evidence suggests that this is a quite recent trend.

The most in-depth snapshot we have of Highland Dress of any period are the 56 kilted portraits in The Highlanders of Scotland, painted in the 1860s. Not a single belt is to be seen under a waistcoat. Every dirk belt seen supports a dirk, save a single one, a belt worn over the waistcoat of a jacketless man who is preparing to throw a stone. Hundreds if not thousands of photos, from the beginning of photography up till recent times, show the same.

Modern kilt hire...

(at least they're wearing dirks!)

In the old days... even wearing a dirk, no belt visible under the waistcoat.

Or, the dirk supported by a dirk belt worn over the waistcoat

**carlisle401** · 16th October 15, 07:14 AM

OC Richard, some great photos there.

I suppose I should have stated that the belt is not worn with Mess Dress. Mess dress is Black tie, the only time we wore a belt was when we were in Shirt Sleeve Order or on our jacket in No 1 and No 2 Dress.

Soldiers and Officers do not wear dirks, except for Pipers in Ceremonial Dress. A lot of ex soldiers still wear the Kilts and Trews in the Military manner as showing their respect for their Regiment.

I have seen a lot of civilians with belts, especially at weddings etc. Must be a fashion statement.