Question about “MOD” sporrans

[TheVintageLibertine]

Thanks for the info, Troglodyte. With those pictures as reference, I’m sure that I could identify a pre-1953 model/pattern online. Am I right in assuming that military day sporrans of that vintage are somewhat rare, and so potentially expensive?

[TheVintageLibertine]

That is an interesting side-by-side, OC Richard; thanks!

I quite like the looks of the 1950s version.

The one I found is identical to picture you posted on the bottom right; however, I just realized that the one I found doesn’t have a hole punched for the crowned thistle badge. Would that mean it was never issued?

[OC Richard]

Yes, never issued or at least never worn, because in proper uniform it must have the badge.



(BTW interesting to see the variety of waistbelts/buckles being worn due to the various ranks and offices. The two lefthand ones are explained by this photo.)

[TheVintageLibertine]

(BTW it's interesting to see the variety of waistbelt buckles due to the various ranks and offices.)

It’s funny you mention that, because I was just wondering about the different belts. Even the two Pipe Majors (?) seem to have different style belts! I’m sure there’s a rhyme and reason, but it’s lost on me.

[OC Richard]

It’s funny you mention that, because I was just wondering about the different belts. Even the two Pipe Majors (?) seem to have different style belts! I’m sure there’s a rhyme and reason, but it’s lost on me.

It looks like the Pipe Major is the same man in both photos (Pipe Major Burns). He's far left in both.

Interestingly, in No1 Dress he's wearing the same portrait-oriented buckle as the rest of the pipers, but in No2 Dress he's wearing a different buckle, landscape-oriented.

Generally Pipe Majors wear different hardware, both waistbelt and crossbelt, than the other pipers.

Here's Pipe Major Harvie of 1SCOTS showing the landscape-oriented waistbelt buckle that PM Burns is wearing in No2 Dress above. It's the buckle formerly worn by the pipers of the KOSB, scrollwork, with strap & buckle bearing the Roman numerals XXV (25th Foot, the King's Own Borderers).

BTW the Pipes & Drums of 1SCOTS was disbanded in 2021.

(Notice the way the Drum Major's crimson silk sash catches the light the upper portion appears fuchsia; obviously it isn't really like that.)

(Also for tartan-spotters notice the PM is wearing Royal Stewart in three different sett-sizes.)



Also in that No2 Dress photo the officer is wearing the Sam Browne belt (as officers have since Service Dress was introduced) and there are two men wearing the ordinary RRS buckle but on a black belt. I can't make out the rank/office of either man.

[Grump]

First group picture. You are quite right about the Sam Browne being Officer territory note the pips on the shoulder epaulets. The two Pipe Majors are Warrant Officers (WO2) red sash means up for promotion most likely to WO1 next move is RSM. NCO's wear rank on the sleeves crown with oak leaves WO . Valid rank hooks are worn "V" pointing down. After the amalgamation, as I understand, tartan kilts are all Black Watch. Regimental pipes are former attachments. Royal Stewart belong to Black Watch Pipes awarded by the Queen Mother many years ago. Note the different Glenny's. This is only a guess but the plain ones are most likely former Cameron Highlanders the triple diced doesn't belong here! The parent regiment is NEVER forgotten.
From what I can remember. Sorry if I missed something and I most likely did. Life member Queens Own Cameron Highlanders Association in Canada.

[TheVintageLibertine]

BTW the Pipes & Drums of 1SCOTS was disbanded in 2021.

I had heard that. It’s kind of a shame the pipe band wasn’t maintained when 1 SCOTS were re-badged as 1 RANGER since the cadre of that battalion was and still is largely Scottish.

First group picture. You are quite right about the Sam Browne being Officer territory note the pips on the shoulder epaulets. The two Pipe Majors are Warrant Officers (WO2) red sash means up for promotion most likely to WO1 next move is RSM. NCO's wear rank on the sleeves crown with oak leaves WO . Valid rank hooks are worn "V" pointing down. After the amalgamation, as I understand, tartan kilts are all Black Watch. Regimental pipes are former attachments. Royal Stewart belong to Black Watch Pipes awarded by the Queen Mother many years ago. Note the different Glenny's. This is only a guess but the plain ones are most likely former Cameron Highlanders the triple diced doesn't belong here! The parent regiment is NEVER forgotten.
From what I can remember. Sorry if I missed something and I most likely did. Life member Queens Own Cameron Highlanders Association in Canada.

Thanks for the info, Grump and OC Richard. I love watching YouTube videos of the RRS’ pipe bands, and always scratch my head at the seemingly endless variations of kit. In fact, a YouTube video of parade white the rifle companies in No. 2 dress around Christmas time is what inspired to buy a similar style dat sporran. Your posts helps divine the meaning.

[Grump]

Right is WO2

[Troglodyte]

That is an interesting side-by-side, OC Richard; thanks!

I quite like the looks of the 1950s version.

The one I found is identical to picture you posted on the bottom right; however, I just realized that the one I found doesn’t have a hole punched for the crowned thistle badge. Would that mean it was never issued?

See this for reference - https://morrison-sporrans.co.uk/prod...ar-sporran-l6a

[Troglodyte]

Thanks for the info, Troglodyte. With those pictures as reference, I’m sure that I could identify a pre-1953 model/pattern online. Am I right in assuming that military day sporrans of that vintage are somewhat rare, and so potentially expensive?

They are more not-so-often seen, rather than rare, and the ones that come up for sale are usually the well-used examples - but good condition examples can still be found.

My experience from talking to ex-Jocks of the 1945-1970 era gives me to to understand that the individual soldiers often got attached sentimentally to their sporrans, and would either buy them at the end of their service, or else 'lose' them and pay the fine. Either way, the sporrans went on to see many years' use in a civilian role. Kilts often 'retired' with the soldier in the same way.

Current market prices have a wide variation. I know someone who has four to sell at the moment, at £50 ($62us) but they are in a well-worn condition - still good and usable, but with lots of what you might call 'patina'. For a good example you could expect to pay two or even three times that amount - there are collectors always on the lookout for good examples, who keep the prices high-ish.

One thing I would say is, be cautious when buying from retailers online and eBay. A photo of the genuine regimental purse is used for the listing, but what is provided is something of a far less quality and certainly not a genuine army-issue item. But these are usually sellers from you know where.

As it happens, the sporrans shown in my pictures are both available, and the 1952 one is Cameron Highlanders and has its original chain-strap. PM me if you want to know more.