Women and Kilt Wearing

[Pleater]

The newer, cheaper, less structured kilt-like garments and kilt wannabes don’t have the same construction. That’s why many of them look, to me, sloppy on a man and can be worn by a woman without alteration.

The cheap kilt I bought (the only 'real' one I have encountered in the cloth) is straight up and down, with a piece of nasty cheap flawed cotton sewn in across the back pleats to hold them - irregularly, in 'place'

It is the exact opposite of something that would fit a typical female shape.

I need a shorter wider fell than the typical man - from what I can find out online, and the suppresion of the pleats needs to be concentrated in the middle half of the pleats, and can be abandoned in the pleats at the edges which just fall straight down.

This might be due to my still quite active lifestyle, a lot of walking and cycling - despite being rather overweight I lack the typical female padding on the rump. I have never uttered the DMBLBIT question - (you'll understand if I ever dare to post a photo) - that is always fine, its everywhere else thats the problem.

As I can make almost anything in the clothing and household line I am sometimes surprised at what people regard as acceptable quality of fit and manufacture.

Maybe pipe bands need to seek out someone to smarten them up and get their uniforms properly fitted.

I often see dance teams, traditional English dance and song is another of my passions, and it really shows when one or two of them have got the skill to make and fit clothes. Some of the more punk - or is it Goth now(?) look truly amazing. Even the more staid ones can look really neat.

[Colin]

For the same reason others wear it- it's a symbol of pride in a Scottish/Celtic heritage and a hardworking, sturdy and comfortable garment.

But why not wear a kilted skirt which is usually a fraction of the cost of a man's kilt? Take Kiltstore as an example. My tartan in a kilt is over $500, my tartan in a kilted skirt for my wife is under $200.

[Space Moose]

But why not wear a kilted skirt which is usually a fraction of the cost of a man's kilt? Take Kiltstore as an example. My tartan in a kilt is over $500, my tartan in a kilted skirt for my wife is under $200.

Maybe because it's not as traditional. We go back and forth on this forum for hours about the difference of a centimeter in kilt lenght, the slight upturning of a first pleat, the type of leather in a strap (but not chain!). We obsess about pleating, fabric weight, even the origin of the fabric. Belt width (in or out of the loops), what type of jacket, shirts, hose, flashes, shoes. We on this forum are positively looney about achieving the impossible: what is "the right way", meaning what is most traditional.

Now you'll ask why somebody doesn't just wear a knock-off? Do you at least see why a woman would want to take the same pride and care in wearing it?

I think the opponents break down into two categories (though some may be masquerading in one, but belong in the other):

1: People who think women don't look as attractive in a kilt.

Fair enough, that's your personal taste. I happen to think this is a gross generalization, but personal tastes are suppposed to be different.


2: People who think women shoudn't wear a kilt because "they're for men".

I already talked about this theory, but it does seem to me that those in this camp are a little insecure about their own wearing of a kilt. Meaning that if women started wearing kilts, then when you wear a kilt, it won't be as acceptable, people might think you're crossdressing.I find this notion a little funny.

Men! Kiltwearers! We all are some of the most secure and proud people out there. We face ignorance and intollerance all the time. Think of all the reasons why you wear a kilt proudly, and will continue to do so, regardless of how many people might make fun and show their ignorance.

I have two questions for people in the latter camp:

1) Why deny women that same pride that we get from wearing a true kilt?

2) How could your great pride and confidence in wearing a kilt be affected in any way by women wearing kilts?

By the way, I'd like to add that nobody except on this forum knows the difference between a womans kilt-skirt pleated the other way, and a man's kilt. To the general populace, the alternatives that women 'should wear' are identical to what we're wearing.

Craig

[Moosehead]

I've never actually considered the whole topic, so won't comment directly. However,

1) Why deny women that same pride that we get from wearing a true kilt?

Is it not possible for a woman to be proud of wearing traditional women's clothing(Scots, Irish, whatever), instead of having to wear men's? Or, in this PC-gone-nuts world of ours, is it simply un-PC for men to have something which is ours alone?

[Space Moose]

Is it not possible for a woman to be proud of wearing traditional women's clothing(Scots, Irish, whatever), instead of having to wear men's?

That argument basically boils down to: 'They have somehting else to be proud of, why do they need to be proud of what we're proud of?'

Doesn't that also apply to say a Spaniard who wants to wear a kilt?

'They have somehting else to be proud of, why do they need to be proud of what we're proud of?'

A Japanese person who wants to learn the art of French cooking?

'They have somehting else to be proud of, why do they need to be proud of what we're proud of?'

A person from Ohio wanting to join in a re-enactment of the stand at The Alamo?

'They have somehting else to be proud of, why do they need to be proud of what we're proud of?'

---

I think we'd agree that the reason isn't a good one, for any of the above.

Ask yourself what your real reason is...

Craig

[macwilkin]

I've never actually considered the whole topic, so won't comment directly. However,Is it not possible for a woman to be proud of wearing traditional women's clothing(Scots, Irish, whatever), instead of having to wear men's?

I've refrained from replying on this thread up until now, but Moosehead brings up a very good point. Many of the ladies in our local Scottish Society display their pride in their heritage with arasaids, sashes, scarves, kilted skirts, etc -- traditional attire for ladies -- not once have I heard one say that she cannot be "as proud" as the men because she "can't" wear a kilt.

Here's another point to think about -- not all men display their "ethnic pride" with a kilt -- some, for whatever reason, wear a tie/scarf in their tartan. Others, as Matt mentioned, wear tartan sashes. Still others wear trews, which frequently take a beating around here (the trews), even though trews (tight riding trousers) were common among the gentry in the Highlands, as well as being worn by the Lowland regiments of the British Army. I know gents in our society who wear only blue blazers and club jackets with their chief's crest badge in bullion -- and on that note, there was a recent debate on a Burns forum I talk on about the appropriateness of tartan and kilts at Burns Suppers, since Burns, the Lowlander, would have probably never worn a kilt (but let's not go there)...Are they any less proud since they don't have a kilt? Not in my book.


One may wear their kilt to display pride in their heritage (as I and many others do), but I don't think the argument that women should be able to wear the kilt because they want to display pride in their heritage should be the "be-all/end-all" arguement. There are many ways for both men and women to display that pride, the kilt being just one way.

Regards,

Todd

[Moosehead]

Actually, for me, it doesn't matter. Which is, basically, what I stated first, non?

I think we'd agree that the reason isn't a good one, for any of the above.

It was not a reason, but a question. As someone with a Native heritage, as well as Celt, I would answer the question thusly: in my Native culture, a woman wearing men's clothing is disrespecting herself, not the man.

[Shay]

A person from Ohio wanting to join in a re-enactment of the stand at The Alamo?

You bring up a lot of good points, I enjoy reading them. Thank you.

Speaking of the Alamo, I'm on my way there now so I won't be around for the weekend. (Just so no one thinks I'm abandoning the thread I started.)

[macwilkin]

A person from Ohio wanting to join in a re-enactment of the stand at The Alamo?

Not the best analogy. Few of the Alamo defenders were actually from Texas, save the Tejanos. I count at least 4 from Ohio.

Sorry to be "picky", and I understand what you were getting at, but as a history teacher, I had to point that out.

Regards,

Todd

[davedove]

You bring up a lot of good points, I enjoy reading them. Thank you.

Speaking of the Alamo, I'm on my way there now so I won't be around for the weekend. (Just so no one thinks I'm abandoning the thread I started.)

I don't know if you've been there before, but don't blink or you'll miss the Alamo. I know there's a lot of Texas pride there, but there's not much of it left.