Help with white tie

[Coemgen]

As you can probably tell from my signature, I am studying the Liberal Arts. Part of this major here at U. of La Verne is to pick a "concentration" involving three disciplines. Mine are: Religion & Philosophy, Music, and Psychology (in preparation to enter seminary and thence the priesthood [God and the bishop willing!]).

In fulfilment of the music part of the concentration, I am taking private voice lessons taught by the music faculty. A requirement of taking these lessons is to participate in a few recitals put on by the voice students throughout the semester, in which they sing the music they've been working on with their instructors. These performances are to be performed in white tie in the University Founder's Auditorium.

I asked for, and received permission to wear my kilt. I have a Prince Charlie jacket and vest, as well as various accoutrema to outfit myself for a black tie occasion (black tie, wing-collar french cuff shirt, studs, fly plaid, etc). So, my question is this: in terms of Highland dress, what constitutes white tie? Do I need to merely get a white vest and tie, or is there something more I might want?

This will be one of the few occasions when I care (to a certain extent) what others will think of my appearance, so I want to look sharp and make a good impression.

[Coemgen]

For reference, here I am in my black tie get-up at my senior prom:

[McClef]

I wish I could remember my St Andrews graduation ceremony better in terms of those who wore a kilt to graduation - I don't remember that many did to begin with.

Non-kilted men wore a white bow tie and winged collar but with an ordinary suit and then the black graduate gown. By the time you had knelt before the Chancellor and received your hood (and been hit on the head with John Knox's red hat!) the tie was fairly obscured in any case.

I have a pic somewhere - will have to scan it.

[Phil]

Following on from McClef, the graduates wearing kilts at St. Andrews simply replace the bow tie with a white one. The PC is a pretty formal dress as it is. Three things from your photo, you shouldn't wear a "bunnet" (headgear) to a formal event and it is not usual to wear a buttonhole with a PC jacket. Also a more formal sporan with a silver cantle would be expected for "white tie". Otherwise your outfit looks great, just wear a white tie with the wing collar.

[Arlen]

The occasions I have been kilted in a white tie situation I have gone ahead and worn a white cravat or bow tie and a black shirt.
It worked fine and I certainly didn't have any comments.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

White tie is just that, white tie, and the rules are the same whether kilted or in tails.

FORMAL WHITE SHIRT WITH WING COLLAR;
WHITE WAISTCOAT;
WHITE TIE;
TARTAN HOSE or DICED HOSE or BLACK HOSE;
DRESS SPORRAN (silver mounted);
BLACK EVENING JACKET (Prince Charlie coatee);
BLACK EVENING SHOES (well polished plain black shoes; NO brogues).

As previously stated, do not wear your bonnet, and do not wear your plaid. When you can afford to up-grade your sporran, do so. Either one of those silver mounted fur things or a long horse hair or goat hair sporran is appropriate for white tie.

While living in Europe I attended (on average) six white tie dinners a year, plus two or three white tie balls. I did this every year for nearly twenty one years, so I probably have more real world experience than anyone else on this forum.

The whole purpose of formal attire is to blend in, not stand out. You are supposed to look like everyone else, but be remembered for your wit, charm, and intellect. If you stand out because of the way you are dressed, you will be mocked, not admired.

Like I said, it's all about conforming. And doing it so well that you are admired for it.

[Gauranga]

Whatever the occasion, it’s always good to put some effort into your appearance. This can help show your hosts and companions that you were looking forward to spending time with them, and may help you feel a little special.

Dressy clothes can be expensive, so if you’re on a budget it’s good to have some items that are very versatile. For women, the little black dress is a great staple, and for men a dark suit can get you through many occasions.

Besides having a good wardrobe, another challenge can be interpreting suitable attire based on the invitation, as times and expectations are changing when it comes to dressing up. So here are a few guidelines and suggestions to help you pick the right attire.

White Tie
It is very rare to be invited to a White Tie event, unless it is a diplomatic event. For a White Tie event, men should wear a white bow tie, white waistcoat and black jacket with tails. Women should wear an elegant floor-length evening gown, gloves and jewelry. Historically “Formal” meant White Tie, but nowadays Formal generally refers to Black Tie.

Black Tie
For women, this historically would have required a long dress, but today a short dress or evening suit may do. For men, this requires a tuxedo. A tuxedo should be worn with a tuxedo shirt with matching studs and cufflinks, a bowtie (preferably hand-tied), patent leather shoes, and either a cummerbund or a waistcoat (never both). If you wear a cummerbund, it should be worn with the pleats facing up.

Black Tie Optional
For Black Tie Optional, you’ll have a little more selection in what you wear. You may simply dress the same as you would for a Black Tie event, or women may also wear dressy separates and men may wear a dark suit and tie.

Creative Black Tie
Creative Black Tie allows you to interpret Black Tie with a modern flair. Women may still wear a cocktail dress or gown, or evening suit, and men may wear a tux but with a bolo tie, black shirt without a tie, or something more daring but in keeping with the theme.


Excerpt from "Mr. Manners Quick and Dirty Tips for a More Polite Life"

I hope this helps. I'm sure you can take this and apply it to wearing a kilt to your event.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

Creative Black Tie
Creative Black Tie allows you to interpret Black Tie with a modern flair. Women may still wear a cocktail dress or gown, or evening suit, and men may wear a tux but with a bolo tie, black shirt without a tie, or something more daring but in keeping with the theme.


Excerpt from "Mr. Manners Quick and Dirty Tips for a More Polite Life"

I somehow doubt that Mr. and Mrs. Manners would accept an invitation that stated--Dress: Creative Black Tie.

[davedove]

White Tie
It is very rare to be invited to a White Tie event, unless it is a diplomatic event. For a White Tie event, men should wear a white bow tie, white waistcoat and black jacket with tails. Women should wear an elegant floor-length evening gown, gloves and jewelry. Historically “Formal” meant White Tie, but nowadays Formal generally refers to Black Tie.

Black Tie
For women, this historically would have required a long dress, but today a short dress or evening suit may do. For men, this requires a tuxedo. A tuxedo should be worn with a tuxedo shirt with matching studs and cufflinks, a bowtie (preferably hand-tied), patent leather shoes, and either a cummerbund or a waistcoat (never both). If you wear a cummerbund, it should be worn with the pleats facing up.

Black Tie Optional
For Black Tie Optional, you’ll have a little more selection in what you wear. You may simply dress the same as you would for a Black Tie event, or women may also wear dressy separates and men may wear a dark suit and tie.

Creative Black Tie
Creative Black Tie allows you to interpret Black Tie with a modern flair. Women may still wear a cocktail dress or gown, or evening suit, and men may wear a tux but with a bolo tie, black shirt without a tie, or something more daring but in keeping with the theme.

I have never been to a white tie event and probably never will be. In fact, I can say that I have never been to an event that was strictly black tie.

Probably the events that I have attended would probably be classified as Creative Black Tie Optional, things like formal nights on cruises and such. Tuxedos are fine to wear to the event, but certainly not required, and you don't have to follow the strict dress code.

[The Barry]

Since I'm not a man of international intrigue, I will most likely never go to a true white tie event. That being said, I think that, in today's fashion, there is more wiggle room in black tie dress than there was say, 50 years ago.

As far as "blending in" is concerned, let's think about this. Unless it's a completely Scottish affair (rare here in the states, especially in Washington), you aren't going to "blend in" with a kilt on. Don't delude yourself, people are going to notice the pleats, that's what they're there for.

I don't agree that you shouldn't be noticed for your clothing. Maybe it's my vanity, maybe I'm just smooth and good looking. I could always wear the normal, black tie, white shirt, generic tux; or I could add some slight touches and make a couple of choices to really make my black tie outfit my own.

For instance, when I'm being held down by the pants-man, my tux is double breasted. I wear it with a black shirt with hidden buttons, and an off white tie and waistcoat. I don't care what anybody says, it's truly stunning, and some serious clothing snobs have given me my props when in this attire at a black tie event with a bunch of penguins.

So let us take this into account with a kilt. Go ahead, throw away that white shirt if you don't like it. Do you have a color in your tartan that needs to be emphasized? Maybe your tartan has black stripes in it, try a black shirt. Experiment with tie color. It's clothing, go ahead and make a statement. I promise, if you wear a not-white shirt with a kilt to a black tie event, nobody is going to mock you for your shirt. They are going to envy you for the way a kilt looks on a confident man who knows how to dress. By the way, a black shirt under a black waistcoat makes women weak in the knees! I kid you not.

And as far a brouges are concerned, maybe it's true that they aren't for white tie events, but I've worn them and seen them worn at black tie evens often. Of course you'd wear brouges, they're a Scottish dress shoe!

Just my two cents, not trying to ruffle feathers, just putting out some options based on personal experience.