Wearing kilts of other tartans than your clans.

[macwilkin]

I suppose that is true for the mindset of most in the modern world, a new tradition of clan tartans is real, in a sense.
But it stems from misconceptions and myths, and therefore, though it may be a tradition, it's one for the ill-informed.

I also suppose that it was not actually a tradition in the old days, but rather, a trend and consequently, a custom.

You really should have a look at albanach.org, scottishtartans.org, kiltmaker.blogspot.com, or simply speak to Mr. Matthew A.C. Newsome, of the Scottish tartans museum, he's very good with that stuff.

Please note that I have nothing against you, or am arguing with you, it's just that this notion of clan tartans being ancient and all simply isn't true.

Matt will be the first to tell you, though, that even though the concept of clan tartans does not have an ancient pedigree, enough time has passed to make it a de facto tradition, and one to be respected. While I agree 100% that clan tartans have not been handed down through the mists of antiquity, to simply dismiss someone having pride in their clan's tartan as "ill-informed" just doesn't seem cricket. If it's not for you, then great. For some, there is very powerful symbolism behind their tartans.

Matt is a member and frequent contributor here, btw. I'm also the proud owner of one of his kilts in the Iowa tartan, which although designed in 2003, has very special significance for me, as it honours my family who immigrated there.

regards,

Todd

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

I suppose that is true for the mindset of most in the modern world, a new tradition of clan tartans is real, in a sense.
But it stems from misconceptions and myths, and therefore, though it may be a tradition, it's one for the ill-informed.

As one of those now charcterized as "ill-informed", perhaps you could enlighten me (and others) as to precisely how long it takes for a trend, or a custom, to become an established tradition? I would have thought that the more-or-less 185 years that we Scots have identified specific tartans with specific clans would have constituted "a tradition". Where have I erred?

[JSFMACLJR]

post deleted

[The Barry]

Steady boys! Steady!

For me, I won't wear a tartan that I don't have a connection with. I'm a Douglas, so when I wear tartan, I wear Douglas. I also wear the Irish National, to celebrate the Irish heritage in my family. But you won't find me wearing another family's tartan. Not judging those that do (especially those without clan affiliation), but it's not for me.

[gilmore]

I suppose that is true for the mindset of most in the modern world, a new tradition of clan tartans is real, in a sense.
But it stems from misconceptions and myths, and therefore, though it may be a tradition, it's one for the ill-informed.

I also suppose that it was not actually a tradition in the old days, but rather, a trend and consequently, a custom.

You really should have a look at albanach.org, scottishtartans.org, kiltmaker.blogspot.com, or simply speak to Mr. Matthew A.C. Newsome, of the Scottish tartans museum, he's very good with that stuff.

Please note that I have nothing against you, or am arguing with you, it's just that this notion of clan tartans being ancient and all simply isn't true.

I always find it amusing that people who claim that the pedigree of clan tartans isn't old usually can't trace their own pedigree to half that age.

[Bugbear]

I always find it amusing that people who claim that the pedrigree of clan tartans isn't old usually can't trace their own pedigree to half that age.

Or it's been made up and stretched to wear the tartan someone wants to wear because they like the way it looks.

[Kiltman]

In the last few years there has been research done into the DNA of the British Isles. The result is that if you have any British Isle in you, you have it all. Not a big surprise. I agree with Matt and others that you should wear what you wish.

[English Bloke]

Of my 8 yard woolies, I have a Bruce, a Johnstone and an Australian National. My grandmother was a Bruce and last born in a family of seven daughters and therefore, really, the last of a line. To continue the family name in the only possible way, my mother was given the name Bruce as a middle name which is unusual for a girl. My Sister's middle name is Bruce and My middle name is also Bruce and I have a son who's middle name is Bruce as well. My Dad was a Yorkshireman so I wear a Tartan which acknowledges my Grandmothers scottish heritage and besides, Yorkshire Cricket Club Modern doesn't do it for me (no disrespect intended).

I have no blood connection to the Johnstone line however I have looked into their history and I quote from an interesting article here:

Clan Jonston/Johnstone Assosiation (U.K.) ...The de Bruce family was to play a pivotal role in the identification and development of the Johnstones, the two families becoming close allies over the years. Five hundred years after the title of the Lordship of Annandale had been granted to the De Bruce family, King Charles II was to grant it to Lord James Johnstone, the Chief of the Johnstone Clan...

In my tiny mind I have created a connection which doesn't make me feel so bad about myself after reading these threads. I hope no-one called Johnston/e or anyone else for that matter, has taken offence. This was not my intent and I am very proud of both my Bruce and my...

Mmmmm... moving swiftly on!

I have, in my opinion, good and valid reasons for owning an Australian National and they are very personal to me. I have explained to you in another thread, the Englishman on my Fathers side who fought as an Anzac at Gallipoli and was later Killed in Flanders so I'll not go over it all again. Sadly the Aussie Kilt doesn't encompass my grossly inflated form so is now worn by my wife as it fits her perfectly. Ironically, my wife is Turkish. She too wears it proudly. She also walked proudly with me in the battlefields of Gallipoli on our visit there in 2005.

Mustapha Kemal Ataturk's 1930's address to grieving New Zealand and Australian families: "Those heroes that shed their blood and lost their lives...you are now lying in the soil of a friendly country. Therefore rest in peace. There is no difference between the Johnnies and the Mehmets to us, where they lie, side by side here in this country of ours. You, the mothers who sent their sons from faraway countries wipe away your tears. Your sons are now lying in our bosum and are in peace. After having lost their lives on this land, they have become our sons as well."

My reasoning may not be at all traditional, but it is certainly historic in terms of my history at least and I also think, respectful. I am comfortable in what I wear and why I wear it... Almost!

Of my PV Kilts I own a Black one, a Black Watch one and a MacLeod Ancient. I like them very much but I fear my MacLeod Kilt may see less wear than previously as I have no connection, real or concocted, to this clan. In deference and respect to Jock Scot's writings on this issue, I see where you're coming from; but then again I have real Kilts to wear now!

Idea sold to the man in the Bruce!! Thanks Jock! I probably will still wear it now and again but not where any MacLeods might see me and I suppose that includes posting pictures on here. I've often said I don't care what people think about what I choose to wear but that should not and does not include people who care about the Kilt.

[Bugbear]

... I agree with Matt and others that you should wear what you wish.

That is not what I seem to be hearing from the Scottish and Traditionalist members of the forum. Rather, that one should only wear or have one tartan, and to do otherwise is disrespectful, possibly insulting.

I don't know..., but I have rethought the advice "wear the tartan you like" in relation to traditional kilts because of this.

[BassClefB]

I am currently in the process of saving for a kilt in my family's tartan (Lamont), but I do wear kilts of other tartans for reasons that are specific to me. Whether they are warranted by 'traditionalists', I don't know. I wear a Black Stewart because two of my dearest friends in life are Stewarts and are practically family. They are both groomsmen/bridesmaids in my upcoming wedding, and I honor their presence in my life by wearing the Stewart tartan. I wear an Irish National kilt on occasion because my Irish lineage is very strong and traceable very far back on my mother's side. I wear the Black Watch because it is considered for the most part to be 'universal', and because it is the only heavyweight wool kilt I own, and I wear it for practical reasons in cold weather. Now, with that said, I do wear a Weathered MacKenzie because I like the look of the tartan. With that said, I would never wear any of the kilts that do not have a firm link to my heritage to any function where the wearing of another tartan than my own may be considered 'offensive'. I have researched the history and lineage of the MacKenzie tartan so I can offer insight if someone asks.

If I had not chosen to wear a tartan other than my own when I decided to try wearing kilts, I must say I probably would not have dug so far into my own family's history and learned as much as I have in the process. The thought of ordering a custom made kilt in my family tartan never occurred to me a few years ago, but now it is essential to me! The wearing of kilts and the wisdom of this community in my education about it all has given me a renewed sense of place, family, and appreciation for the area in which I live (which is steeped in Scot/Irish lineage) and the connections I have with my family and others who share the appreciation for Highland culture.