"Kilt check" question

[Chas]

With all respect intended, don't you think that's taking it a little far? Are we all that delicate that we must call the bobbies and report an assault when a curious lassie wants to get an eyeful of under-the-kilt goodness?

That said, I've never been kilt-checked by anyone other than my wife. But I have a hard time believing I'd take it as an assault unless there was malice intended. If I were that sensitive to a playful peek under my kilt, I'd probably just not wear the darn thing.

No Tobus, I do not think I am taking it a little far. We don't get to pick and choose. If you accept it for yourself, then you are saying it is OK for it to happen to your sister, your mother, your wife, your child.

I say again - we don't get to choose. If you think it is acceptable for "a curious lassie", to try and find out what you have between your legs; then you have to accept a 22 stone rugby player doing the same. You don't get to choose; if you accept the one, then you accept everything.

Regards

Chas

[HarborSpringsPiper]

I still don't understand this, even after all of these years. I especially don't understand the gals who appear shocked when I ask if I can see what they are wearing under their skirt/jeans after they attempt the kilt check on me. "That's different!" Whatever . . .

The only time that I truly have been angry is when it has been done or attempted while I was piping. I really don't want to stop playing mid-tune while the crowd is enjoying the music, just because someone is being an idiot . However, it is pretty much an attack while being in an undefendable position. Usually happens on St. Paddy's Day. Uh oh . . .

[Zardoz]

Let me start off with a couple of definitions..."Kilt Check" vs. "Kilt Lift"

In my lexicon, "Kilt Check" is a descreet maneuver, done with permission at many Renaissance faires, Highland games and other kilt-friendly activities. A proper inspection is a formalised "ritual" that generally involves asking first, then running a hand on the outer thigh, under or over the kilt, looking for shorts etc. At Renaissance faires if the checker finds something, they usually annouce it to the crowd. So the asking gives the potential offender an out. I have no problems with proper kilt checks, it happens to me at faires all the time.

"Kilt Lifts" on the other hand, are generally done by people sneaking up on you, mostly in the pub. These are quite impolite in my book! Honestly this rarely ever happens to me. If a woman does it, I'll usually just slap her hand away, and give her a verbal warning, reminding her that she'd be offended if I pulled that on her etc.. usually in jest. If it's a guy showing off for his friends, I'll usually do the same thing, only while questioning the reasons for his interest in my junk! Although that doesn't always work, I have taken a fellow by the ear and led him over to a bouncer before.

That being said, I do not think of kilt lifts as "assault" ! Assault is when somebody comes at you with a broken bottle! If a woman lifted my kilt and I called the police, "She touched me in my bad place officer!".....Well, I'd never be able to go in that pub again!

I think attitude has a lot to do with it. If you in your pre-kilt days you could go in a pub, fade into the woodwork, and drink your pint without dealing with anyone, recognize that you cannot do that in a kilt! The kilt won't let ya'! You will be noticed, and how you deal with the attention is the key.
If you have that "sorry I'm in a kilt, leave me alone" introvert attitude, you will be on the defensive.
Better to project a "Yeah I'm in a kilt! your prayers are answered!" vibe, it puts you more in control of your interactions.

[HarborSpringsPiper]

That being said, I do not think of kilt lifts as "assault" ! Assault is when somebody comes at you with a broken bottle! If a woman lifted my kilt and I called the police, "She touched me in my bad place officer!".....Well, I'd never be able to go in that pub again!

Your correct that it is not an assault, it's battery.

Assault and Battery: Two separate offenses against the person that when used in one expression may be defined as any unlawful and unpermitted touching of another. Assault is an act that creates an apprehension in another of an imminent, harmful, or offensive contact. The act consists of a threat of harm accompanied by an apparent, present ability to carry out the threat. Battery is a harmful or offensive touching of another.

The main distinction between the two offenses is the existence or nonexistence of a touching or contact. While contact is an essential element of battery, there must be an absence of contact for assault. Sometimes assault is defined loosely to include battery.

Assault and battery are offenses in both criminal and Tort Law; therefore, they can give rise to criminal or civil liability. In Criminal Law, an assault may additionally be defined as any attempt to commit a battery.

At Common Law, both offenses were misdemeanors. As of the early 2000s, under virtually all criminal codes, they are either misdemeanors or felonies. They are characterized as felonious when accompanied by a criminal intent, such as an intent to kill, rob, or rape, or when they are committed with a dangerous weapon.

http://legal-dictionary.thefreedicti...lt+and+Battery

I doubt I would ever involve the law and would guess most cops in my neck of the woods would laugh at me if I ever tried. I doubt they would laugh very long if someone pressed the matter with their superiors though. Nonethless, it is battery.

Mostly I consider it impolite and unwarranted. No shortage of those kinds of people in the world.

[HighlandMax]

I have it happen to me every sunday, at Mass. I'm in the choir, and a fellow choir member......another guy.....will lift my kilt up to see what's underneath. He is a married man, and a friend, so, I just take it as him trying to be funny. No one else has ever tried it.......yet.

[Steve Barclay]

Thanks guys! I asked because there were a few attempts on me at our St. Pat's parade on Sunday, usually by women in trousers or jeans on whom I couldn't get my own back- typical! Well we'll see what happens tomorrow in the pub!

[ccga3359]

This subject has come up many times in the past (& I still don't know if Grant ever finally got his much desired kilt check ).

While some don't care either way, others are of the "one free pass" feeling, whilst others look at it as "assault".

I've always wondered how the would be kilt-checker would feel if the shoe were on the other foot?

Thank you Terry and yes it has happened. It was when I was dropping off material at Robert's (of RKilts fame) for my paintball kilt. This b*tch comes trotting over and just does it willy-nilly without asking, as if "doing her duty". I was initially shocked, stunned and embarassed (because, believe it or not, is not a daily occurance for me). When I was able to readjust my composure and hemline I gave her a stern look and she just stares back at me as if there is nothing wrong with invading my personal space. The situation was not eased what with Robert laughing his butt off! "This is Isadora and wait until Xmarks hears that you just got your first kilt check!". All I can say is I'm glad Robert's dog doesn't have a facebook page or she'd tell all of my secret!

[dfmacliam]

A dog investigating a new "odor" does not constitute a kilt check...reguardless how desperate the kilt wearer desires to be kilt checked...LOL

[Steve Barclay]

Thank you Terry and yes it has happened. It was when I was dropping off material at Robert's (of RKilts fame) for my paintball kilt. This b*tch comes trotting over and just does it willy-nilly without asking, as if "doing her duty". I was initially shocked, stunned and embarassed (because, believe it or not, is not a daily occurance for me). When I was able to readjust my composure and hemline I gave her a stern look and she just stares back at me as if there is nothing wrong with invading my personal space. The situation was not eased what with Robert laughing his butt off! "This is Isadora and wait until Xmarks hears that you just got your first kilt check!". All I can say is I'm glad Robert's dog doesn't have a facebook page or she'd tell all of my secret!

[NewGuise]

If you think it is acceptable for "a curious lassie", to try and find out what you have between your legs; then you have to accept a 22 stone rugby player doing the same.

While I prefer that neither loudly mocks what they see, I can deal (and have dealt) with both, but then I have little trouble with public nudity - multiple extensive (and complete) costume changes already in high school theatre (not to mention repeated doses of west coast living in the late '60s and '70s) made me pretty much immune to that brand of embarrassment.

But that is in regard to me, not others. I deem the attitude - that anyone wearing a kilt is fair game - equivalent to that which states that anyone dressed "provocatively" is "asking for it" sexually.

So I don't get angry, although I do have some ready come-backs. I am a little old guy, but I have made a large hunky stranger blush in abject silence while a crowd in the bar laughed simply by retaining my composure and stating loudly "You must be very desperate." I doubt he'd try that again, with anyone.