Thinking of Leaving

[Steve Ashton]

O'Callagahn,

It is not an impression that the Forum Moderators are required to notify any and every person involved if a post is reported, it is a fact.

You are living proof that the Moderators do not take sides, they do not treat reports emotionally. They weigh the facts and act only in accordance with the published rules.

You were not penalized simply because it was found that the report that was submitted was just that, a report. the Moderators found that you had not violated the rules. During the process you were offered the chance to speak on your behalf. The Moderators listened to you and took your input into account in their deliberations.

The matter was resolved amicably, no harm done and no one holds it against you.



I've been seeing complaints of over-moderation ever since this forum started back in 2004. And you know what? It is simply not true. Yes, the forum is moderated but the stress needs to be put on the first part of the word. The forum is moderate. Those who are asked to become Moderators are asked because they have a proven record of being moderate in everything they do.

I would like everyone to realize that if a thread is closed, if a post is removed, there is a very good reason behind it. The voting among the Moderators showed that a rule was in fact broken.

Perhaps instead of what some seem to think about the forum being over-moderated is in fact the result of more people attempting to skirt the rules.


Our rules are simple. There are only 12 of them. Basically all we ask is that our members remember that this forum is about kilts. We ask that you leave your politics, religion, and weapons at the door. And we ask simply that you think about the other members who share this forum before you hit submit.

[kscowboy1866]

I'm still a newby on this forum but I've been a moderator on gaming forums for more than a handful of years now. I have to deal with adults as well as children on a wide range of issues pertaining to gaming, personal matters, computer issues, arguments over how to properly run the forum, complaints about posts, admins, moderators, and even server owners. It doesnt matter where ya go, your going to find the grass isnt greener on the other side of the fence. I say ya should stick around and maybe just take a short break and come back.

[Dale Seago]

I'm still a newby on this forum but I've been a moderator on gaming forums for more than a handful of years now. I have to deal with adults as well as children on a wide range of issues pertaining to gaming, personal matters, computer issues, arguments over how to properly run the forum, complaints about posts, admins, moderators, and even server owners. It doesnt matter where ya go, your going to find the grass isnt greener on the other side of the fence. I say ya should stick around and maybe just take a short break and come back.

As a moderator myself on another forum suite -- and a relative newby here as well -- I couldn't agree more!

[Highlander31]

...It doesnt matter where ya go, your going to find the grass isnt greener on the other side of the fence.....

Your correct, kscowboy1866, it has been my experience that people are pretty much the same wherever you go.

BTW, I think it was Jimmy Dean who said "The grass may be greener on the other side of the fence,...but it's just as hard to mow.

[Steve Ashton]

As you can imagine this thread has been the topic of discussion among the Moderators just as it has generated almost 100 posts here.

On behalf of the entire staff I would like to thank all who have participated in this thread. I hope that this discussion will be the start of some truly good things. We have had an opportunity to air some issues and to hear from some of our members who don't post often.

To the OP of this thread biblemonkey, I say that I hope you will re-consider leaving the forum. As I said earlier, if you are just taking some time away, the forum will still be here when you decide to come back.

I know not everyone will always agree on everything. Heck, it would be a very boring place if we did. The polite and respectful way everyone posted is proof that this forum is a truly unique and wonderful place.

I think that most who have something to say have had an opportunity to do so. As I have nothing further to add I am going to step out of the discussion. I'm always around if you have any questions or further comment. All you need do is ask.

[AFS1970]

See this thread is an example of how the positive is easy to observe but not easy to report. Almost 100 posts in the thread and 2 (or possibly 1.5) complaints. Do the other 98 of us really need to notify the mods that we don't have a complaint? That seems odd at best.

Now in a thread like this that is not only a reasonably civil discourse on issue, but actually involves moderators and the site owner, complaining about a post is, at least to me, uncalled for. If there is something in this thread you don't like, or if you disagree with something any of us said, then post in this thread like the rest of us.

Steve said Rule #7 has been around since before he owned the site, so I have to assume that if he (or a moderator) thought this thread violated it, they would have taken action. As a matter of fact in a thread about too much moderation, how could you think otherwise? Isn't complaining like saying that there is not enough moderation?

Now several people posted that this thread was not a farewell post and thus did not fall under Rule #7. That being the case perhaps Rule #7 needs to be amended, to read that IF a farewell thread becomes bitter or nasty it will be deleted. While I have no immediate plans to leave this forum, I would like to think that if I did, it would be OK to say goodby to those I met here. I think part of behaving like a grown up is not being nasty when leaving. Members here should be given the benefit of the doubt and it should not be assumed that they will get nasty.

[PEEDYC]

I have not managed to read all the comments on this thread (but most of them) A question to the Mods ... do you monitor who the complaints come from? Is it a few people with not so thick skins that report threads or is it a good spread of members? It may well be that as in other walks of life it is the minority that spoil it for the rest ..... Just a thought.

[Chirs]

Post reported.


Typoes offend me.

[McClef]

There is a reasonable spread PEEDYC but it would also be fair to state that it is often the same people who feel concerned enough to post a report.

But it is indeed rare that these reports are done just to be vexatious (though it can happen). Sometimes it would be helpful though if folk suggested what rule they thought was being broken as comments do not always make this clear and it is not fair that we should then have to guess. In such cases we often seek further clarification from the reporter.

Sometimes a Moderator may actually be the reporter but when this happens we are acting as an ordinary member of X Marks and we have to use the reporting system in the same way as anyone else. It gives us no pleasure having to to that and perhaps we have developed, through experience, a sharper feeling of when it is necessary and when it is not. But whatever action we take as individuals it is still subjective to the collective decision of all the Moderator Team.

[Bing]

The difference now is that the system is more transparent. You know when things are done by the Moderators. It is policy that no post is ever moved or closed without leaving behind a notice of some sort. No thread is closed without a full reason being stated.
No thread or post just disappears. There is always an explanation left for the action of the Moderators.

But it isn't completely transparent Steve. I had a post reported a while back. Mea culpa, I will admit to pushing to the edge on that one. The mod did fully inform me after about a week and I was given one demerit point, that aspect of the system was at least functionally transparent.

It was what went on before where there was no transparency. I was not informed who got their knickers in a knot and pushed the button (although I have a good inkling who it was). I was not given the opportunity to have a discussion with them via PM to iron out the differences. Odds are I would have withdrawn the post, I'm a reasonable guy.

But here's the rub, I respect everyone's right to hold their beliefs, but I don't have to actually respect the belief itself. Beliefs are ideas, and when we can not discuss or even criticize ideas then we have a problem. When ideas become immune to criticism, when ideas become so sacred because everyone is afraid to comment then we get things like people killing cartoonists for drawing pictures they don't like. That's where I draw my line.

The mods did their thing in the background too, conducting the investigation and holding the vote via PM and only then coming out with their ruling afterward.

We have a system where the Grade 2 playground begins the process and the Court of Star Chamber completes it. Neither is transparent, neither is suitable for adult interaction.