Alternate Kilt Pin / Brooch Placement

[Rex_Tremende]

I tend to think of all brooches as pins, but not all pins are brooches, depending on their size, shape and function. In highland attire, a brooch might be used to secure a plaid, but would probably rarely be worn below the shoulder. The kilt pin is usually attached on the lower corner of the outside apron, ostensibly for weighting it down, but really just for show.

Any bit of costume jewelry that is attached to clothing with a pin and clasp can be considered a brooch. Fellers tend to eschew anything that is too terribly ornate. Slim, elongated, and lightweight - might make a good kilt pin. Heavy, chunky, and compact or round - probably a brooch. A brooch worn on the lapel or shoulder is a brooch. Move it down onto the kilt, and you've got a kilt pin, unless it is huge and meant for a plaid - and then you've got a injury waiting to happen.

Regards,
Rex.

[Rex_Tremende]

Who is Henry in the photo?

That's HRH Henry of Battenburg, son-in-law to Queen Victoria, and my newest kilted idol.

(And check out the wall of fame behind Robert!)

I thought I'd post this picture here as it shows that it need not be a brooch, even the blanket pin can be worn high.

Thanks for finding that and posting it here, Glen.

Regards,
Rex.

[Bugbear]

I thought I'd post this picture here as it shows that it need not be a brooch, even the blanket pin can be worn high. ...

It might make sense to put the blanket pin higher. In some other thread it was being discussed that the blanket pin as kilt pin started as a practical item. Perhaps having it within reach of your hand without having to lean over or pick up the apron would be handy.

[Malcolm MacWilliam]

Aye, I saw the photos behind Robert. To use an overused phrase, awesome! Henry of Battenberg. I know there was a Battenberg who had an "affair" with Lily Langtry (again, I should know this stuff, being a Royalophile!), but it's not the same one, right? (Ok, to wikipedia!). Malcolm

[Malcolm MacWilliam]

I'll answer some of my own question! I'm thinking of Louis of Battenberg, the Langtry connection. Were Henry and Louis related...most likely, huh? Louis married grand daughter of Victoria and Henry married daughter?? (Time to get the Royal genealogy out!) Malcolm

[McMurdo]

I would have to say there is historical precedent for it here are some more examples




George, Duke of Kent (1902 - 1942), (left) with his mother, Queen Mary (1867 - 1953), Elizabeth, Duchess of York (1900 - 2002) and George, Duke of York (1895 - 1952) at Balmoral Castle, Scotland. Prince Albert, Queen Victoria's husband, purchased Balmoral Castle in 1846, and the small castle which stood in the 7,000 hectare wooded estate was redeveloped in the 1850s. The granite building was designed by Aberdeen architect William Smith with suggestions from Albert himself, who decided the interior decoration should represent a Highland shooting box with tartan or thistle chintzes, and walls decorated with trophies and weapons. Queen Victoria often visited the Highlands with her family, especially after Albert?s death in 1861, and Balmoral is still a popular retreat for the present royal family. (Photo by Hulton Archive/Getty Images)


2nd September 1935: A royal gathering at Balmoral Castle in Aberdeenshire on the occasion of the Duke of Gloucester's engagement to Lady Alice. Original Publication: From left to right, the Duchess of Buccleuch, King George V, Lady Alice Montagu-Douglas-Scott, Henry William Frederick Albert, Duke of Gloucester and Queen Mary. Queen Victoria's husband, Prince Albert, purchased Balmoral Castle in 1846, and the small castle which stood in the 7,000 hectare wooded estate was redeveloped in the 1850s. The granite building was designed by Aberdeen architect William Smith with suggestions from Albert himself who decided the interior decoration should represent a Highland shooting box with tartan or thistle chintzes, and walls decorated with trophies and weapons. Queen Victoria often visited the Highlands with her family, especially after Albertfs death in 1861, and Balmoral is still a popular retreat for the present royal family. (Photo by Hulton Archive/Getty Images)

[Malcolm MacWilliam]

Can we ID these folks? I know that first picture is Queen Vic, grandchildren and the famous John Brown! Malcolm

[McMurdo]

Sorry Malcolm
I've updated the photos with the descriptions I have.

[thescot]

Great photos and discussion, guys, no matter on which side of the fence one resides.

It is my limited understanding that kilts pins were (at least for modern purposes and uses) initially used because Queen Victoria wanted to be sure that the Highland regiments' soldiers were completely discreet. No flashing allowed before her majesty.

I like the pins/broaches worn high. As to their "appropriateness," I have no opinion. I just like them fine. But I don't think of them as actual kilt pins, since they tend not to serve quite the same purpose as a blanket pin worn low. At least not quite as effectively.

On the other hand, they look really cool on Robert! And Mr. Brown. And the Duke of Windsor. And the king! Who tend to wear proper blanket pins up high.

Oh, well. Again, go for it. I especially like those rather small, discreet looking round broaches Robert wears. I might try it sometime.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

A couple of observations:

(1) I believe HRH the Duke of Rothsey is wearing his kilt pin according to military regulations-- Other photographs of kilted officers show this same placement.

(2) HRH Prince Henry's kilt pin is placed (approximately) mid way between the top and hem of his kilt.

Now I suspect that pinning the inner and outer aprons of the kilt at the mid point (like Prince Henry) would not necessarily damage the kilt but would keep it from flapping in the breeze in an unbecoming manner.

Looking at a number of pre-WWII photos of civilians, they wear the kilt pin much lower, as do most gentlemen today. While trying to figure out why, I observed that this placement allowed for the wearing of a dirk. Civilians set the top of their kilt pins more-or-less even with the bottom of the dirk, and slightly ahead of the tip of the scabbard to allow the pin to be seen. If not wearing a dirk then a more elaborate pin, often with a cairngorm, or other stone, was worn pinned to the kilt in about the same position the pommel of the dirk would occupy.

As dirk wearing fell from fashion, the kilt pin remained (uselessly, in my opinion) exiled to the bottom corner of the the outer flap of the kilt. My advice to anyone wearing a kilt pin would be to wear a blanket pin, like HRH the Duke of Rothsey, during the day, and for evening wear follow the example of HRH Prince Henry and wear a nicely jeweled pin at pommel height.