opinion on a "knockabout" kilt?

[Newfoundlander]

Hi All,

Thanks to everyone for giving me a ton of good information and helping me get this ball rolling!

I guess to toss in my thoughts on the poly-viscose discussion above. Chemically speaking it is a cellulose-based polymer fibre that's treated with acetate to ensure cohesion (if I'm remembering my organic polymer chemistry right, I'll caveat it by saying I don't normally do that kind of chemistry). From a materials view, I think the viscose term is introduced to reflect the manufacturing process of the fibre. My understanding is that a chemical slurry is made and squeezed out through a tiny pin-hole to spin the fibre (think meat pasta press). So I think Brooke is right on in saying a viscose isn't a fabric. it's just a special way f making a fibre. That's my understanding anyway, and I haven't done too extensive research into the exact process or chemistry, just a bit of passing reading.

I guess the end result is a decent feeling kilt that I won't mind beating around the pubs or hiking trails in =)

Thanks again everyone!!

[CMcG]

<snip>
However, I'm not sure why we would assume that Marton Mills is the true and accurate version and anything else must be falsely advertised? Well, actually, I have a suspicion as to why we would, but that's a whole other issue.

Cordially,
Brooke

I have nothing against the people who market those 16 oz "PV" kilts and have products from several of the vendors listed earlier in this thread.

What I'm trying to clarify for Newfoundlander is that the feel of Marton Mills poly viscose and poly viscose kilts made by HoS is different. There has been a fair amount of previous discussion on this board about the difference... perhaps Rocky R and Steve Ashton might be able to clarify it better than I.

And while we're quoting sources, here's two that say acetate and viscose are related but not the same:

"VISCOSE cellulose is treated with caustic soda and carbon bisulphide, converting it into a gold liquid about the color and consistency of honey, called viscose. Viscose is forced through fine holes in end of a nozzle, called a spinnerette, directly into a chemical bath where it hardens into fine strands. When washed and bleached these strands become rayon yarn.

...

ACETATE cellulose is combined with acetic acid [refined vinegar] making a substance called cellulose acetate. This is dissolved in acetone, then forced through the holes in a spinnerette directly into a tube. In the tube, warm air evaporates the acetone and the cellulose acetate emerges as dry filaments."

http://www.fabrics.net/miracle-fibers-rayon-and-nylon/

"Viscose (also known as viscose rayon) is a group of fabrics and yarns produced by extruding cellulose solution through holes in a spinneret, then coagulating the resulting filaments in an acid (the viscose process). There are several different sort of viscose fibres made by modifying this process, eg crimped, hollow, high tenacity (stronger).

So viscose rayon is a particular type of cellulose fibre made using the viscose process, and it's also often called just 'viscose' or just 'rayon', because it's the commonest kind of rayon. Other kinds of rayon are cuprammonium rayon and acetate rayon."

http://hiraeth.com/ytg/qanda/answers/rayon.htm

[Newfoundlander]

Thanks CMcG for doing and background reading on the fabric and for posting that! Much appreciated!

Also too, thanks for highlighting the differences in the feel of the respective companies' fabrics. Whilst I am looking for a "cost effective" option for this one as I don't intend to wear it to any very formal occasions, I still want something that looks and feels right and will last. On that, I'll take your and Brooke's advice here and wander over to USAkilts to check out the marton mills fabric and compare.

Much appreciated gents!

John

[CDNSushi]

It's an interesting question... What the heck IS polyviscose? Truth be told, I never even heard of it until I became a member here. And a quick Google search for the word links to XMarks as the number 1 hit, with little else offering any further information...

I do however know viscose. It is used in making rayon. When I was still in university, I did a science project for my organic chem class where I actually MADE rayon fibers by squirting a chemical slurry through an injection needle into a reactive bath, causing fibers to be formed. (Gotta toot my own horn here... I won that contest, improving my course grade by 10% and receiving a brand new scientific calculator as my reward)...

[McClef]

Your challenge (should you choose to accept it) is now to create a kilt using a similar scientific method!

[CDNSushi]

Your challenge (should you choose to accept it) is now to create a kilt using a similar scientific method!

Jeez... Back then, we were given all the chemicals we needed for our experimentation. All we had to do was fill out a requisition, give it to the TA and he ordered it from the chem supply company (all within reason, of course).

Can't imagine financing that on my own... Sure would put a whole new spin on making a DIY kilt from scratch... Spinning your own viscose fibers.

[Newfoundlander]

Most mornings I'm lucky if I can get the coffee done right, let alone make my own fabric, haha!

Here's a question though:
Earlier here, Chrisupyonder listed the standard kilt by stillwater kilts. I've read the feedback on their site and talked to Jerry and they seem like a good crowd, and have outstanding feedback and price. Does anyone here own a SWK kilt, or know someone who does, and can comment on the quality?

I can get a kilt sent up here for about $100USD + tariff (which might actually be covered under NAFTA since it's an American manufactured product). It's pretty hard to beat that price point. That's the same as jeans and SO much better!

Thanks lads!

[CDNSushi]

I had a SWK Standard... It's not PV. It's acrylic. Very soft, pills easily, gets fuzzy quickly, and it's not as stiff and crisp as wool or PV. From my experience with PV, acrylic, and wool, I'd say that the PV was the most wool-like of the three.

But for a knockabout kilt it's not too bad.

[Droid]

I'm happy with my PV casual from USA Kilts. The Teflon coating is great to ward off small spills. I have a one year old at home and I wear my PV kilt around him without hesitation. Meal time or play time, the casual kilt keeps up with me and cleans off easily with a little water.

[CDNSushi]

Just a quick little addition... Because there is very little discussed that hasn't been discussed before (and I don't mean that as a snipe, merely an observation)... I've dug up some wisdom from the dusty, X-Marks history books...

It's a comparison of fabrics written by our very own Steve Ashton. Perhaps this will help answer your questions in a little more detail.

http://www.xmarksthescot.com/forum/f...fabrics-58373/