What Makes a Kilt Formal?

[Colin]

Part of the issue not previously mentioned is the AUDIENCE present. If you were to go to a Burns Night with several knowlegdeable (and well dressed) kilties, a casual kilt would stand out more. If you were to go to an event where you were the only one kilted, then a casual kilt with formal accessories would be fine. I believe that 95% of people would never know the difference. Would it matter to you?

I like to assume that everyone at any event will be knowledgable (I have been cornered a few times when I least expected it) and that I should do my best just in case they are. Assuming that no one will know that difference seems like a disservice to them and to me. Wear the best you have. No one can fault anyone for trying their best and if someone does fault you than it shows their ignorance.

It's like the parents that bought their kids the $2 "transmorphers" for Christmas and figured they were the same as the $10 transformer. The kids always knew

[ccga3359]

It's like the parents that bought their kids the $2 "transmorphers" for Christmas and figured they were the same as the $10 transformer. The kids always knew

I'm sorry that you got a transmorpher for Christmas. I share your pain. When I first came to Canada every kid wore Levi's. Everyone ecept that homely little English kid with the sticky out ears and crooked teeth. I begged and and pleaded to be allowed to wear jeans and not just any jeans but Levi's. Well my mum, who worked at the Bi-way relented and picked up a pair for me. Chinese made, elastic waistbanded Golden Horse jeans. I got beaten up at school a lot more after that...

[Colin]

I'm sorry that you got a transmorpher for Christmas. I share your pain. When I first came to Canada every kid wore Levi's. Everyone ecept that homely little English kid with the sticky out ears and crooked teeth. I begged and and pleaded to be allowed to wear jeans and not just any jeans but Levi's. Well my mum, who worked at the Bi-way relented and picked up a pair for me. Chinese made, elastic waistbanded Golden Horse jeans. I got beaten up at school a lot more after that...

I feel for you Grant. All I wanted were adidas and all I got were the zellers brand with 5 stripes.Funny that now as a parent I buy my kids non name brand (they grow too fast) , but certainly pay top dollar for what I want

[fluter]

McMurdo, I hope that I did not give offense! If you don't know it by now, I am prone to indulge in pedantry for humorous effect. Where I said "traditionally" it has almost become "historically" --- and of interest only to a few old fogies & Miss Manners. However I believe Miss M. would back me on the categories.

Well sorry Fluter but we are talking Formal kilt/Formal kilt outfit,

I wasn't quite sure what Kent meant by formal: possibly a continuum of degrees of formality? I know what you meant by semi-formal, I was just (a) teasing you (b) pointing out that the terminology is not as simple as it may seem (c) in short, playing with words. If you were not amused, I apologize.

1.that a formal outfit should not include a Sportkilt.

No argument here! at least, not unless substantial wagers are involved. I had a feeling the original disputants may have been thinking "No Utilikilts in a dressy setting." Which would be fair enough, until you showed them the UK "tuxedo" kilt.

2. None of us were formally dressed in the photo Grant posted, we were in Semi-Formal kilt outfits.

...or allowing for pedantry, you were all in informal kilt outfits. Traditionally speaking.

why then do we as kiltwwearers have semi formal sporrans,

Search me! IMO they are somewhat useless, but I'd buy one if I liked it.

BTW I was always taught that Black Tie was Formal not Semi Formal.

I was pointing out that it was not "always" so. Formal (was) white tie or that stuff you wear for diplomatic receptions; semi-formal, black tie or a daytime formal (of the morning coat ilk); informal, business suit.

[James MacMillan]

[QUOTE=kiltedsawyer;449544]

Both! But is there any real difference between the cut of a pair of jeans and the cut of a pair of formal pants? No.

Man!....you have been kilted for a while!

One hated cloth tube is like every hated cloth tube....................right?

[ccga3359]

[QUOTE=James MacMillan;449558]

One hated cloth tube is like every hated cloth tube....................right?

Would you not consider a kilt as a cloth tube once fastened?

[Kent Frazier]

Guys, remember that it was a Yank who asked the question.

So what, exactly, was it that indicated I was a "Yank"?

[ccga3359]

So what, exactly, was it that indicated I was a "Yank"?

That distinctive texas drawl where each word leans against the next.

[Kent Frazier]

I had a feeling the original disputants may have been thinking "No Utilikilts in a dressy setting."

This has been a great discussion and I'm learning quite a lot from it. To the best of my knowledge, neither my wife for our friend had even heard of a Utilikilt. I know I hadn't until I joined these forums.

The discussion was about a character in the Outlander series of books by Diana Gabaldon wearing a "formal kilt". I said I didn't think there was a "formal" kilt, but that the accessories determined the formality. I'm not sure exactly the time period she was referring to, but the books are about a woman who travels back in time in Scotland. The "modern" time period in the books is just after World War II.

[Chef]

It's definitely both. A proper hand-sewn kilt is obviously perfect for any degree of formal and it works well with most casual outfits. It does not however do extremely casual very well. In as much as a really good pair of tailored slacks doesn't either. You can only dress them down so much before they start to look out of place. I think the main reason is the tailoring. Any item that is properly tailored will have a certain formality to it no matter what you wear with it.

On the other end are Utilikits and similar garments. No matter what you do they can only look so formal just as jeans can only look so formal.

For some of the traditionally styled casual kilts I agree that where the waist falls makes a huge difference as to whether it can be used for formal wear or not.

Would you wear a pair of jeans and consider yourself formal? No. But is there any real difference between the cut of a pair of jeans and the cut of a pair of formal pants? No..

That's like saying a Tank and a Utilikilt are cut the same James.

I like to assume that everyone at any event will be knowledgable (I have been cornered a few times when I least expected it) and that I should do my best just in case they are. Assuming that no one will know that difference seems like a disservice to them and to me. Wear the best you have. No one can fault anyone for trying their best and if someone does fault you than it shows their ignorance.

Colin I absolutely agree. I have heard many times (including on this forum), "They won't know the difference" and it really bothers me. Personally I would rather see someone go rent a tux than wear a kilt badly for a formal event.

But would someone be wrong if they had a utilikilt made from really nice fabric and then wore it with a PC?

Well I think the cut is the problem. Jeans, even if made with black worsted wool would still look silly with an evening jacket.

so too people should refrain from wearing a Sport Kilt to a Burns Night. I really think you have to draw the line somewhere.

Absolutely!