A little history please?

[camellid]

What were they used for way back then?

The Sporran was to put things, right? What did the put in them back then?

The kilt pin? Did they have ant other purpose?

The fly plaid? Was it just used for looks? (Or did they wipe there mouths LOL)

The Sgian Dubhs? Well I know it's a small Knife. Was it there for a reason? (Or there to open a bottle of something or other?)

I guess what I am asking is a small history lesson. I was just wanting to know so if someone ever ask me I would be able to pass it on. Thanks Todd

[Big Mikey]

The very short answer.

Sporran- general carrying, coins, food, whisky

Kilt pin- weight to hold down the kilt corner, decoration

Fly plaid- dress item as today, also see "great kilt"

Sgian dhu- all purpose knife, eating, defense

Try doing searches, there is a lot of info available in the forum.

[CDNSushi]

To answer all the questions would be rather tiresome so I volunteer an answer for one of them. The story behind the kilt pin, which is most likely an urban legend, is that Queen Victoria was inspecting a Scottish regiment on a rather windy day, and in order to protect the modesty of one of the troops, she removed her hat pin and deftly pinned down the apron of the young solider's kilt. Since then, it is said to have become de rigeur to wear a pin in one's kilt... But more often than not, such colourful stories are more fancy than fact.

As to the rest, this is also where I would re-recommend "Kilts & Tartan Made Easy" by Dr. Nicholas J. Fiddes. I mentioned it recently on another thread. It is a free eBook you can download from here: http://www.scotweb.co.uk/kiltsandtartan/

It gives some history. A good place to start.

[camellid]

Thanks, that is perfect that is all I needed. I will download that now.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

Sgian dhu- all purpose knife, eating, defense

Well... not really.

As has been posted elsewhere, the sgian dubh first makes an appearance as part of highland attire in the 19th century as a small skinning knife used by servants to dress deer in the field. It was quickly adopted by the upper classes (those who went deer stalking) as the "badge" of someone who shot game while in the highlands in much the same way German hunters placed the "gamsbart" in their hat. Far from being a general purpose knife, it was a specific tool used for a specific purpose. While it could have been used for eating it probably wasn't, and as far as defense is concerned it is probably better than nothing, but it was never intended to be a defensive tool.

Today, with the exception of the Officer's Model sgian dubh, this small utilitarian knife has largely been reduced in status to an item of (usually junk) jewelry, or replaced by a bottle opener or sham replica.

[ForresterModern]

The sgian dhub story I heard was that it was a small weapon for defense kept openly visible with its top/handle visible above the hose. When visiting another clan's stronghold/home one surrendered all his weapons as a sign of trust in his host, except for the sgian dhub, which he was allowed to keep openly visible as an understood gesture of mutual trust, with just a little bit of mutual distrust.

Not sure how valid that one is either.

[Carolina Kiltman]

The sgian dhub story I heard was that it was a small weapon for defense kept openly visible with its top/handle visible above the hose. When visiting another clan's stronghold/home one surrendered all his weapons as a sign of trust in his host, except for the sgian dhub, which he was allowed to keep openly visible as an understood gesture of mutual trust, with just a little bit of mutual distrust.

Not sure how valid that one is either.

I added the emphasis.

Short knives carried in various places on the body were usual possessions of men from time immemorial. In Northern Europe throughout the Middle Ages, one always brought one's own cutlery (fork's were not used as eating tools then) when coming to dinner, as the host probably did not have enough for all of the guests.

Was the Sgian Dubh one of these? It could be a descendant.

That it was a skinning/utility knife carried by the Ghilles on a hunt, and picked up by those who hired them as an affectation, has to my "nose" the "smell of truth"

The romanticised one above, is probably much less likely.

[camellid]

Most of the time, way back then. Everything that was made had a purpose. That's why I ask about those few things. I was just thinking if I only had those few things, while in the woods or somewhere like that. What would I use them for?
Like the fly plaid. I would have used that for sleeping or carring the food I just hunted.
I will do somemore searching and find out. If you all know any more web sites that are good for looking things like that up. Please feel free to post them here for all of us to look at. Thanks Todd

[Geoff Withnell]

I added the emphasis.

Short knives carried in various places on the body were usual possessions of men from time immemorial. In Northern Europe throughout the Middle Ages, one always brought one's own cutlery (fork's were not used as eating tools then) when coming to dinner, as the host probably did not have enough for all of the guests.

Was the Sgian Dubh one of these? It could be a descendant.

That it was a skinning/utility knife carried by the Ghilles on a hunt, and picked up by those who hired them as an affectation, has to my "nose" the "smell of truth"

The romanticised one above, is probably much less likely.

And it still is the custom in many groups that a man carries a small knife. In my family and where/when I grew up, a man without a knife was considered a wuss. Did not need to be a great big thing, a little pocket knife was ok, but some sort of blade. As to the Sgian Dubh, I carry one when kilted not as decoration, but because it is the most convenient way to carry the small knife I wish to have on my person. And I suspect that is the real genesis of the Sgian Dubh, a convenient way to carry a useful tool.

Geoff Withnell

[puddlemuddle]

What were they used for way back then?

The Sporran was to put things, right? What did the put in them back then?

The kilt pin? Did they have ant other purpose?

The fly plaid? Was it just used for looks? (Or did they wipe there mouths LOL)

The Sgian Dubhs? Well I know it's a small Knife. Was it there for a reason? (Or there to open a bottle of something or other?)

I guess what I am asking is a small history lesson. I was just wanting to know so if someone ever ask me I would be able to pass it on. Thanks Todd

How "way back when" are you talking...it would seem to me that the only thing in this list that predates the 19th sentury is the sporran...and like already stated it was used very similarily to how it is used to day except for different items..back then a "highlander" would have kept his food (oats mainly) in it as (especially with regards to sporrans that still had the hair on them) where rather water proof and kept the food dry for when he was in the field "droving" or working...or running and hiding...whichever was the case. Of course Gentlemen Highlanders would carry things like their money and such (although a lot of Gentleman Highlanders would have worn Trews...a different form of what trews are today even).
But I digress.....
The Fly Plaid is simply a 19th century fashion item that is supposed to represent the romanticized "great kilt"......the Kilt pin...well, I had never heard the story of the Queen, and always thought it was just a way for those not used to wearing a kilt (when it became popular in the 19th c.) to feel more secure about the kilt not flying up in the wind....but if you think about it, you only pin the outer apron, and if the outer apron blows up..it still leaves the under flap visable....
As far as the sgian dubh is concerned I agree withthe theory that is was a ghillies implement....
My two cents...
Cheers,
Chad