tartan above the waist

[warrior]

Taking this train of thought from another thread just what are the unwritten or written rules of tartan above the waist.
I know the evening wear classic waistcoat cut from the same cloth as the kilt either bias or straight but what other options are there. I know daywear can follow the same but what about two different colourways or setts (large/small, same clan, totally different). What say the rabble?

My reason for asking is that I really like the look of weathered MacLeod of Harris and I think it in a 16oz would make a really nice quilted or fleece lined waistcoat for daywear here in the south. Today's weather only called for minimal layers, a polo and mid weight shirt sufficed. Could a light shirt/shirtjacket/waistcoat of one pattern mix well with kilt of another.

[AKScott]

Yes, can do. I think I bookmarked page two of this thread because of the Atholl Highlanders, but it is in my favorites:

http://www.xmarksthescot.com/forum/f...84/index2.html

[MacLowlife]

Cold weather has come to my end of the South, so walking around in just a waistcoat is only a fond memory, but I am interested in your idea.

Would you make something on the order of a down vest/ hunter's gilet, with a tartan shell, or would you make a traditional 5 button waistcoat with a thicker profile?

In the traditional forum, the response to wearing a tartan waistcoat is going to be slightly confusing, but pretty vehement. Everybody loves them, especially on the diagonal, but it had better be YOUR clan tartan. It doesn't have to match or be aesthetically pleasing in any other sense, so long as it has a name that is similar to the name of the tartan on your kilt. Thus, the rusty reds of ancient and weathered colors are perfect to wear with the sharp aniline reds of modern colors, but you can't ever ever ever in your long legged life wear something very similar, but called by another name. "Matching" colors or combinations mean nothing without the proper nomenclature. Special attention must be paid to the feud between the McDonalds and the Campbells.*

Here are a couple of examples:
MacLeod of Harris and MacLeod of Lewis Fine
Dress Gordon and Black Watch / Campbell Unacceptable
McKay and Black Watch/ Campbell (Practically Undistinguishable but) Unacceptable
MacDonald Hunting and Black Watch Incendiary to both sides
Never mind how pleasing the combination of colors might be.


* Many accounts of the Great Feud place the end of active hostility at 1745, though subsequent posts will be at pains to observe that the conflict persists to this day. It has nothing to do with either soup or hamburgers.

[warrior]

I was thinking a traditional lapelled five button 16oz or greater lined with either shearling or quilting. I had not thought of a gilet but that would work as well.

Amazingly, even though I am eight generations removed from Skye my branch of McLeods remember the MacDonalds. The details got cloudy but I was told of a burning church and a sea cave as a child. As to the Campbells I was always told that there are two never to trust, an Englishman and a Campbell.

[Jock Scot]

I was thinking a traditional lapelled five button 16oz or greater lined with either shearling or quilting. I had not thought of a gilet but that would work as well.

Amazingly, even though I am eight generations removed from Skye my branch of McLeods remember the MacDonalds. The details got cloudy but I was told of a burning church and a sea cave as a child. As to the Campbells I was always told that there are two never to trust, an Englishman and a Campbell.

The MacLeods were only returning the compliment after the MacDonalds did terrible things to the MacLeods and this sort of thing went on for centuries. Many other Clans did awful things to each other too.

This is precisely why the wearing of different Clan tartans and badges are best avoided. It is just one of those "niceties" that the Scots have developed in the last couple of centuries to avoid inter-clan upset in more civilised times and occasions.

[warrior]

The MacLeods were only returning the compliment after the MacDonalds did terrible things to the MacLeods and this sort of thing went on for centuries. Many other Clans did awful things to each other too.

This is precisely why the wearing of different Clan tartans and badges are best avoided. It is just one of those "niceties" that the Scots have developed in the last couple of centuries to avoid inter-clan upset in more civilised times and occasions.

Sounds like situation normal for many families over the holiday season just past. ;)

[MacLowlife]

I will start by noting this is NOT MacLeod of Anything, but Lands End has a couple of patterned down vests, including one that comes surprisingly close to a weathered MacLeod of Harris:


http://www.landsend.com/pp/PatternDo...&origin=search

They call it "Smoky Olive Plaid" but at $29, it may be worth looking at closely. And if it doesn't work out, you can take it back to Sears...

A quick web search reveals other gilet-type tartan vests, including some with wool shells. A smart tailor or seamstress might be able to tell you about grafting a tartan shell onto an existing down vest.

Do send us a picture if you can work it out... Oh and you might inquire about a layer of Nomex in there if you are planning to wear it to any sea caves or churches...

[creagdhubh]

The MacLeods were only returning the compliment after the MacDonalds did terrible things to the MacLeods and this sort of thing went on for centuries. Many other Clans did awful things to each other too.

This is precisely why the wearing of different Clan tartans and badges are best avoided. It is just one of those "niceties" that the Scots have developed in the last couple of centuries to avoid inter-clan upset in more civilised times and occasions.

Precisely, Jock. You wont find any Macphersons wearing Comyn (Cumming) tartan and badges, and vice versa, it just isn’t done, and it’s understood among Scots – particularly those Scots of Highland origin.

[creagdhubh]

Sounds like situation normal for many families over the holiday season just past. ;)

Quite right!

I have Macpherson relatives (great aunt and uncle) that live in Kingussie in Inverness-shire, Scotland, and they are very suspicious of any person with the name Campbell - they have always been like this, their parents were like this, etc, etc. Some feuds, disagreements, back-stabbing, horrible acts of cruelty, etc, etc...amongst the clans, are not always entirely forgotten by some - especially in the Highlands, and even in today's modern, more civilised world. However, the funny thing is, throughout Clan Macpherson history, there really hasn't been too much feuding with the Clan Campbell, and all of their branches. Rather, the feuds tended to be with some of our closer neighbors in upper and lower Badenoch.

Sidenote - I recall reading a sign above a pub door near Fort William reading, "No Campbells Allowed," seriously. I think I have a photo of it somewhere, this was around 5 or 6 years ago. I am not attempting to pick on the Campbells, just using them as an example.

Cheers,

[davidg]

Sidenote - I recall reading a sign above a pub door near Fort William reading, "No Campbells Allowed," seriously. I think I have a photo of it somewhere, this was around 5 or 6 years ago. I am not attempting to pick on the Campbells, just using them as an example.

Cheers,

Are you sure it was not Glencoe? The inn there (the Clachaig?) has, or had, such a sign outside its door reminding everyone of the Glencoe Massacre