Stillwater

[bubba]

For those thinking about a Stillwater kilt, this id from their website.

SWK will be CLOSED from September 26-October 2, as we will be on vacation. We will not have any eBay sales running during this time. If you order off the website, your items will not ship until we return!

We are unfortunately out of some tartans/sizes temporarily, and we are scrambling to build up stock! Due to an unexpected recent rush of orders for 38" Black Watch Standard kilts, we are out of them until about the 20th of October. Any other sizes we are out of should be ready before the end of September.

[RockyR]

I will have to admit although Jerry has a great reputation, and you all have praised his service and his kilts, I have gotten a bit turned off by the recent revelation that they are made in Asia. I would rather support our north American Kilt Makers. So Maybe I would buy a stillwater but probably not, but I don't buy Japaneses cars either. Even the ones made in Ohio!
That's just me though, If's it's not a Lincoln I don't look very long at it .......

[beverlonian]

I have just bought a Stillwater kilt. Posted from USA on Tuesday, around my waist in UK on Friday. How's that for a delivery! Plaudits to the Postal Services (US & UK).

[Sciuropterus]

John, I used to think like you, but nothing is that simple!

The following explains it rather well:

[www.CapitalismMagazine.com] "According to a recent poll, 80% of Americans think it their patriotic duty to give preference to American-made products. But “Buy American” is wholly un-American in both its economics and its philosophy.

America’s distinction among all the nations of the world is that it enshrined political and economic freedom. Although we have departed greatly from our original laissez-faire principles, to the whole world America still symbolizes capitalism. Americanism means understanding that a free market, domestically and internationally, is the only path to general prosperity.

International trade is not mortal combat but a form of cooperation, a means of expanding worldwide production. The benefits of international trade flow to both trading partners, even when one of the countries is more efficient across the board. This is the “Law of Comparative Advantage,” covered in every economics textbook. Free trade does not destroy but creates employment.

The lucrative workings of free markets do not depend upon lines drawn on a map. The economic advantages of international commerce are the same as those of interstate, intercity, and crosstown commerce. And if we kept crosstown trade accounts, the “trade deficits” that would appear would be as meaningless as are our international “trade deficits.” Fact confirms theory: the U.S. ran a trade “deficit” practically every year of the nineteenth century, the time of our most rapid economic progress.

Philosophically, Americanism means individualism. Individualism holds that one’s personal identity, moral worth, and inalienable rights belong to one as an individual, not as a member of a particular race, class, nation, or other collective.

But collectivism is the premise of “Buy American.” In purchasing goods, we are expected to view ourselves and the sellers not as individuals, but as units of a nation. We are expected to accept lower quality or more expensive goods in the name of alleged benefits to the national collective.

Most “Buy American” advocates are motivated by misplaced patriotism. But for some the motive is a collectivist hostility towards foreigners. This xenophobic attitude is thoroughly un-American; it is plain bigotry.

Giving preference to American-made products over German or Japanese products is the same injustice as giving preference to products made by whites over those made by blacks. Economic nationalism, like racism, means judging men and their products by the group from which they come, not by merit.

Collectivism reflects the notion that life is "a zero sum game," that we live in a dog-eat-dog world, where one man’s gain is another man’s loss. On this premise, everyone has to cling to his own herd and fight all the other herds for a share of a fixed, static, supply of goods. And that is exactly the premise of the “Buy American” campaign. “It’s Japan or us,” is the implication. If Japan is getting richer, then we must be getting poorer.

But individualism recognizes that wealth is produced, not merely appropriated, and that man’s rise from the cave to the skyscraper demonstrates that life is not a zero-sum game -- not where men are free to seek progress.

Accordingly, individualism holds that the interests of men do not conflict -- provided we are speaking of self-supporting individuals who pay for what they get. Where there is free trade, the exchange of value for value, one man’s gain is another man’s gain.

The same harmony of men’s interests applies in the international arena. One nation’s enrichment raises the standard of living of all other nations with which it trades. Which nation adds more to your standard of living: Japan or Bangladesh? And how would you fare if Japan were suddenly reduced to the economic level of Bangladesh?

The patriotic advocates of buying American would be shocked to learn that the economic theory underlying their viewpoint is Marxism. In describing the influx of Japanese products and investment, they don’t use the Marxist terminology of “imperialism” and “exploitation,” but the basic idea is the same: capitalistic acts are destructive and free markets will impoverish you. It’s the same anti-capitalist nonsense whether it is used by leftists to attack the United States for its commerce with Latin America or by supposed patriots to attack Japan for its commerce with the United States.

Contrary to Marxism, one does not benefit from the poverty or incompetence of others. It is in your interest that other men -- in every country -- be smart, ambitious, and productive, not stupid, lazy, or incompetent. Would you be better off if Thomas Edison had been dim-witted? Nothing is changed if we substitute a Japanese inventor for Edison.

More and better production is good for all men, everywhere. What’s good for Toyota is good for America. That’s individualism, and that’s Americanism.

Government interference with free trade is un-American. Sacrificing one’s standard of living in order to subsidize inefficient domestic producers is un-American. The tribal fear of foreigners is un-American. Resentment at others’ success is un-American.

A patriotic American acts as a capitalist and an individualist: he buys the best, wherever it may be found.

About the Author: Dr. Harry Binswanger, a longtime associate of Ayn Rand, is a professor of philosophy at the Objectivist Graduate Center of the Ayn Rand Institute."

[bubba]

I distrust anything associated with Ayn Rand. Rand was a social darwinist and an advocate of the law of the jungle in the social context.

[Raphael]

I really don't see a problem in buying a Pakistan made Kilt from an American Vendor. Although part of the revenue is going out of the country, but Still you are still doing business with an American Company. Also, his products fill the void of being the entry level model.

Also, what is wrong of giving economic help to a third world country?

[Freelander Sporrano]

I think the fact that they are honest about it is avery good reason to trust them.Some companies (Not kilt companies) would try to hide that fact.

Just recenlty a Norwegian Porcelain company received a design award for a dinner sevice design. The design was Norwegian.

However the product itself was made in Pakistan. The company which is a household name in Norway had done nothing to inform the buying public of this fact. It took a television doc team to do that....

So I like the honesty of stillwater in this case

PS. I havn't a Stillwater kilt.

[Sciuropterus]

Bubba, I have no idea where your "law of the jungle" (a term I associate with anarchy) theory came from, as that is not even close to any position she held. Ayn Rand was an advocate of good courts, police and military so that citizens would be able to go about their life and work without interference from criminals, you may recall she was the featured speaker at the United States Military Academy at West Point for their 1974 graduation ceremony. I will be the first to admit that Ayn Rand is tough to swallow at times, but I have never encountered a better defender of the right to conduct ethical business & trade without interference. I have met Dr. Binswanger (who wrote the article I quoted) when he was at the University of Minnesota, do not pass up a chance to hear him speak! Anyway this getting way OT, I need to get ready for my first vacation in 3 years!

[bubba]

Rand advocated a society that ignored the poor and helpless. The principle if you can't compete, die. Yes, the philosophy advocated strict policing and strong military, but only to protect the successful, not those crippled and disabled.

[Dreadbelly]

John, I used to think like you, but nothing is that simple!

The following explains it rather well:

[www.CapitalismMagazine.com] "According to a recent poll, 80% of Americans think it their patriotic duty to give preference to American-made products. But “Buy American” is wholly un-American in both its economics and its philosophy.

America’s distinction among all the nations of the world is that it enshrined political and economic freedom. Although we have departed greatly from our original laissez-faire principles, to the whole world America still symbolizes capitalism. Americanism means understanding that a free market, domestically and internationally, is the only path to general prosperity.

International trade is not mortal combat but a form of cooperation, a means of expanding worldwide production. The benefits of international trade flow to both trading partners, even when one of the countries is more efficient across the board. This is the “Law of Comparative Advantage,” covered in every economics textbook. Free trade does not destroy but creates employment.

The lucrative workings of free markets do not depend upon lines drawn on a map. The economic advantages of international commerce are the same as those of interstate, intercity, and crosstown commerce. And if we kept crosstown trade accounts, the “trade deficits” that would appear would be as meaningless as are our international “trade deficits.” Fact confirms theory: the U.S. ran a trade “deficit” practically every year of the nineteenth century, the time of our most rapid economic progress.

Philosophically, Americanism means individualism. Individualism holds that one’s personal identity, moral worth, and inalienable rights belong to one as an individual, not as a member of a particular race, class, nation, or other collective.

But collectivism is the premise of “Buy American.” In purchasing goods, we are expected to view ourselves and the sellers not as individuals, but as units of a nation. We are expected to accept lower quality or more expensive goods in the name of alleged benefits to the national collective.

Most “Buy American” advocates are motivated by misplaced patriotism. But for some the motive is a collectivist hostility towards foreigners. This xenophobic attitude is thoroughly un-American; it is plain bigotry.

Giving preference to American-made products over German or Japanese products is the same injustice as giving preference to products made by whites over those made by blacks. Economic nationalism, like racism, means judging men and their products by the group from which they come, not by merit.

Collectivism reflects the notion that life is "a zero sum game," that we live in a dog-eat-dog world, where one man’s gain is another man’s loss. On this premise, everyone has to cling to his own herd and fight all the other herds for a share of a fixed, static, supply of goods. And that is exactly the premise of the “Buy American” campaign. “It’s Japan or us,” is the implication. If Japan is getting richer, then we must be getting poorer.

But individualism recognizes that wealth is produced, not merely appropriated, and that man’s rise from the cave to the skyscraper demonstrates that life is not a zero-sum game -- not where men are free to seek progress.

Accordingly, individualism holds that the interests of men do not conflict -- provided we are speaking of self-supporting individuals who pay for what they get. Where there is free trade, the exchange of value for value, one man’s gain is another man’s gain.

The same harmony of men’s interests applies in the international arena. One nation’s enrichment raises the standard of living of all other nations with which it trades. Which nation adds more to your standard of living: Japan or Bangladesh? And how would you fare if Japan were suddenly reduced to the economic level of Bangladesh?

The patriotic advocates of buying American would be shocked to learn that the economic theory underlying their viewpoint is Marxism. In describing the influx of Japanese products and investment, they don’t use the Marxist terminology of “imperialism” and “exploitation,” but the basic idea is the same: capitalistic acts are destructive and free markets will impoverish you. It’s the same anti-capitalist nonsense whether it is used by leftists to attack the United States for its commerce with Latin America or by supposed patriots to attack Japan for its commerce with the United States.

Contrary to Marxism, one does not benefit from the poverty or incompetence of others. It is in your interest that other men -- in every country -- be smart, ambitious, and productive, not stupid, lazy, or incompetent. Would you be better off if Thomas Edison had been dim-witted? Nothing is changed if we substitute a Japanese inventor for Edison.

More and better production is good for all men, everywhere. What’s good for Toyota is good for America. That’s individualism, and that’s Americanism.

Government interference with free trade is un-American. Sacrificing one’s standard of living in order to subsidize inefficient domestic producers is un-American. The tribal fear of foreigners is un-American. Resentment at others’ success is un-American.

A patriotic American acts as a capitalist and an individualist: he buys the best, wherever it may be found.

About the Author: Dr. Harry Binswanger, a longtime associate of Ayn Rand, is a professor of philosophy at the Objectivist Graduate Center of the Ayn Rand Institute."

Hogwash.

Sorry for being blunt, but, hogwash. Complete and total hogwash. That whole bit is a straw man.

If we listened to Ayn Rand, we would need to resort to what amounts to slavery to support a crashed bottomless economy. Need proof? Look around at all the child labour sweatshops and slave mills. You don't even want to know about the working conditions in places like Pakistan and China. Buying goods from those countries does not make the workers that made said item any form of wealth. Very slimy people export those goods into this country, take advantage of free trade, and the many loopholes, and screws our own national economy. Those sheets and towels that you buy for three dollars down at your local discount store barely pays for the cost of materials and the cost of importing said rag. Do you think the workers that made it got paid anything? In order to compete, everybody has to lower prices. Fine. Good. Everybody loves low prices. Drop prices to low and create a consumer free for all and you get an Ayn Rand Wonderland. Shipping companies, which haul those goods to that discount store, get peanuts. Those drivers have families. The store it self makes little or nothing for profit. Since it has to lower other goods for competitive sales, it eats even further into it's own profits selling well made quality goods at prices that barely cover the cost. Stores like Walmart are in turn forced to drop wages, and find creative ways to doctor the books and employ workers in order to make a profit. So you wind up with employees that get 39 hour work weeks and get no benefits. Those workers, our backbone workers, the sorts of grunts that nobody cares about, are in turn forced to buy as cheap as possible in order to support themselves, only to further hurt the cause as a whole. It's a ripple effect system. It doesn't work. Why do you think our economy is as weak as it is right now? Small businesses can not compete with the iron law of wages. If people keep hemmoraging money, services, and goods to overseas markets, what do we have left for our selves? We sure as hell ain't putting bread on their tables, much less our own. Come down South some time and check out all the mills that have closed because they can't compete with slavery and the iron law of wages. Whole towns have collapsed. Entire economies have gone sour. So much so that the national economy has staggered. Large businesses can't compete either in the game of slave wage based goods. Buying from sweat shop countries is NOT free trade. It's a one sided deal that tips the scales dangerously and sooner or later something will give.

It has become a viscious cycle. The economy is now so bad and so many people are now way below the poverty line that they have no choice but to support slave wage goods in order to make ends meet, further causing economic collapse. It's a self defeating system that is finally starting to show the promise of a true monster. The only people that can't see this effect are the idealists that either ignore it, pretend it doesn't exist, or have their craniums up their rectums.

Would rather buy from somebody like the good folks from Amerikilts or USAKilts and put bread on their tables and allow them to survive as a business, or heck, even from Bear or some of the other North American kilt makers because they are part of the labour pool that needs jobs to keep our economy floating in the first place. Buy doing this I have some direct means of control over my money, how I spend it, and where it goes. I still have the means of having my economic opinion heard by voting with my wallet. Buying from a sweatshop country robs me of this right.