The Mythological Language called Canadian Gaelic

[Nathan]

Though pages like this one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Gaelic do specify that the term refers to dialects of Scottish Gaelic spoken in Cape Breton and other parts of Canada, I'm uncomfortable with the term "Canadian Gaelic".

It implies that the language has diverged sufficiently to warrant a new name. This is not the case. The dialects spoken in Cape Breton correspond to the dialects that are (and were) spoken in Scotland. Some parts of Cape Breton have more of a Lewis accent, and some parts sound more like Barra. Others, sound like Uist.

It also implies some widespread use of Gaelic in Canada outside of Cape Breton which hasn't been true for a long time.

The difference is no more than one of accents and Cape Breton looks to Scotland to set the orthological and grammatical standards.

The variation is well within the bounds of the variations in Scotland from one island to another. Some have called
Cape Breton "The Westernmost Island in the Hebrides".

One of the particularities of one dialect in Cape Breton is to replace the "l" sound with a "w" sound.

So the "L" in "Slàinte (Slahn-Cha)" or "An Làtha (Un Law)" gets swallowed to the point that it sounds like "Swancha" and "Un Wa". I'd love to know which dialect in Scotland also does this.

This link treats the subject reasonably well:
http://www.unilang.org/viewtopic.php?f=68&t=34255

[Macman]

I am no Gaelic expert, but your post clears up something I've wondered about for a long time. In Alistair MacLeod's book "No Great Mischief", I recall reading that the word "clan" was pronounced "cwown" (I think I have it somewhere near right) by the Cape Breton protagonists. You've just explained why! Thanks for your excellent posts on Nova Scotia and Cape Breton.

[Chas]

this page has been renamed to "Canadian Gaelic" in accordance with Wikipedia article naming conventions. Currently there are four articles which exist on Wikipedia that describe European languages with Canadian dialects: French, English, Ukrainian and Gaelic. The titles of the first three articles are Canadian French, Canadian English, and Canadian Ukrainian.

Regards

Chas

[Singlemalt]

I am afraid in my youth I was the witness to Gaelic slipping away in the rural community I grew up in. My Grandfather was a Scottish immigrant, a native speaker and a Presbyterian Minister. I understand that this was considered a real asset early in his career as many communities desired Gaelic services however the demand slowly died out. He served several small rural churches and I think gave his last services in Gaelic in the late 50's. I believe those would have been at the small congregations at the north end of Victoria County in central Ontario in the villages of Cameron, Argyle, Glenarm and Kirkfield. As a boy I do remember him conversing in Gaelic with older people after the service but not using it in Church.

[neloon]

Nathan,

'Cape Breton "The Westernmost Island in the Hebrides".'
An excellent description.

'One of the particularities of one dialect in Cape Breton is to replace the "l" sound with a "w" sound.

So the "L" in "Slàinte (Slahn-Cha)" or "An Là (Un Law)" gets swallowed to the point that it sounds like "Swancha" and
"Un Wa". I'd love to know which dialect in Scotland also does this'

I don't recall ever hearing that in Scots Gaelic. I believe that children cannot generally produce a correct "l" sound until they are 6 and if the "w" sound persists after this, it is a speech defect or, at least, an affectation.
On the other hand it seems to occur in a number of diverse languages.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L-vocalization

Alan

[Nathan]

Regards

Chas

It's logical but still misleading. I think Canadian English AND Canadian French are more different from their homelands than Gaidhlig. It's also confusing because we have "Irish Gaelic" "Manx Gaelic" and "Scottish Gaelic" and so following that convention "Canadian Gaelic" sounds like an other Language.

I also think the Wikipedia convention breaks down when you scratch the surface. We couldn't accurately describe a single dialect called "British English". To my ears, the posh London accent is as different from Liverpool or Glasgow as it is from Australia. Similarly, the English in say Nothern Peninsula Newfoundland is closer to British Isles dialects than it is to Vancover, BC.

I know it's all nomenclature and there's no perfect system. But if you speak about "Canadian Gaelic" in Canada, most people will say, "What's that?"

I've seen people talk about it on other threads and online as if it's another Celtic language, so I wanted to clarify this for the Rabble.

Reading down a little further in the article I was slagging, I came across this:

Phonology
l̪ˠ→ w
The most common Canadian Gaelic shibboleth, where broad /l̪ˠ/is pronounced as [w]. This form was well-known in Western Scotland where it was called the glug Eigeach ("Eigg cluck"), for its putative use among speakers from the Isle of Eigg.[11]

Read more: http://www.answers.com/topic/canadia...#ixzz2PKj9XEl8

[Chas]

I would change it for you if I could, Nathan, but once Wikipedia have a convention like this, it is in place till the end of time.

Regards

Chas

[Nathan]

I would change it for you if I could, Nathan, but once Wikipedia have a convention like this, it is in place till the end of time.

Regards

Chas

Thanks Chas, that's very kind and I think you're probably 100% correct that it's there to stay. Just thought the xmarkers could use some clarity.

[Nathan]

So I came across this excellent site from BBC called Beag Air Bheag (little by little) which provides free online resources to learn some Gàidhlig.

In addition to the basic conversational/Grammatical stuff: "i's mise Seumas, Ciammar a tha sibh...", there's a section that teaches 5 Gàidhlig songs. Interesting stuff. The fifth song is one of Cape Breton's most famous songs. It's called 'Illean Bithibh Sunndach which translates as Boys be in good spirits and it's all about young men leaving Scotland for Cape Breton and trying to look on the bright side of what was a very sad thing.

While I was very impressed that BBC Alba decided to include a Gàidhlig song from Cape Breton on their site, I was surprised to see how much they altered the lyrics. They didn't just make some grammatical adjustments, though those are there, they changed the whole meaning of the verses.

Compare:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/alba/foghlam/be...05/index.shtml

with

http://www.beatoninstitutemusic.ca/g...-sunndach.html

Perhaps they didn't like the references to getting drunk at a pub in Tobermorry or the dairy cows being milked by young maidens... Or maybe they didn't like that place names were transliterated rather than translated - Nòbha Scòtia rather than Alba Nuadh.

There are some examples of words that are lenited in one version and not in the other as well (eg. ri tighinn versus ri thighinn in the chorus).

Anyway, it's a great song and it's nice that it's included on the BBC site even if it is altered to suit their educational purposes.