when to wear a belt and when not to

[OC Richard]

...one very traditional Laird who commonly wears a kilt belt over his waistcoat with day wear. One also needs to remember that with some forms of evening(dress) jackets the belt is worn either over the waistcoat, or jacket itself depending on cut and style. In this mode I think that the belt is really considered as a dirk belt. As dirks are rarely carried these days one could argue that the belt could be dispensed with. Nevertheless, there are certain dress jackets where the belt is an effective addition.

Hear, hear!

In "the old days" the belt was called a "dirk belt" and was worn to support a dirk, but not otherwise. Likewise the cross-belt was worn to support a sword. "Form follows function" as the saying goes.

The dirk belt would be worn either over the jacket, or more rarely over the waistcoat. Nearly always, in the old days, men were to be seen wearing both jacket and waistcoat, so the modern situation of wearing a dirk belt directly on the kilt, due to no waistcoat being worn, didn't arise.

The idea of the belt having the sole function of supporting the dirk started changing, as best I can tell, in the 1920s when new styles of Evening doublets, the Montrose and Kenmore, were introduced, which were intended to be worn with a belt. The introduction of the Montrose and Kenmore happened to coincide with a trend of greater simplicity in Highland Dress, and the shearing off of weaponry save for the sgian. A host of new Evening jackets were appearing, such as the Prince Charlie, which were worn as part of a sleek understated simplified costume. So we had the ironic situation of a functionless belt being adopted at the very time when most of the traditional do-dads were being abandoned. (These being the dirk belt, cross-belt, dirk, sword, pair of pistols, powder-horn, plaid, and brooch, which were commonly worn with full Highland Dress throughout the 19th century.)

Anyhow the old dirk belt is now, for some reason, being regarded as essential to kiltwearing, and being thought of as having the purpose of supporting the kilt itself. My theory is that this is being driven by Americans who view dirk belt as being the equivalent of the belt worn with trousers. Of course this is a case of false analogy, kilts never before being deemed to require any support.

It's a hideous modern trend to wear the old dirk belt under a waistcoat, the belt being visible, poking out in an ungainly way. The modern Scottish kilt hire and Highland Dress shops are doing their best to promote this, the only motive I can imagine being to hire and sell more stuff and make a bit more money.

The high Victorian full Highland dress



The new 20th century Evening Dress of the post-WWI era, sleek and elegant, with a new jacket style, the "coatee"



One of the new jacket styles, the Kenmore, intended to be worn with a dirk belt (which is so-named in the catalogue)



The current wearing of the belt under the waistcoat, directly on the kilt... what Highland Dress has come to.

[thescot]

Hear, hear!

. . .

The high Victorian full Highland dress



. . .

I have always wanted--just once--to dress like this with pistols and sword and attend the Sponsors Reception at Stone Mountain to see if any one would comment. LOL

[Finistere]

So if I'm correct the norm is, give or take because there are always exceptions

Wearing vest/waistcoat no belt.

Not wearing vest/waistcoat belted.

Kit

[Reiver]

A good thread here....basically good general sartorial 'rules' with exception.

Great pics OC.....slim fella's there...don't see them about as much as one once did

[Kamilavalamp]

I would say it's a matter of personal preference. Traditionally you would not wear a belt with a jacket, but depending on your tastes you could go either way. I always wear my belt with my kilt simply because I can keep my whisky flask tucked in the belt.

[GrainReaper]

I wear a belt with my kilt only when not wearing a vest or coat, I do however wear a belt with trousers when wearing a vest and or coat, but that is because I don't have suspenders.

[Father Bill]

If you're wearing it because you've lost weight, a few minutes with a needle and thread (going all the way through the stabilizer!!!!) will add buttons for suspenders which hide well beneath a waistcoat or jumper, and to a slightly lesser extent, under a jacket too.

[Leprechaun 91]

The variety demonstrated in all the photos within this thread just go to show that there are no hard and fast rules. As such, there is very little the "Kilt Kops" have on us.
I do hold to certain length conventions but rules? ... Nah.

I wear a belt (plate generally) with my tartan kilts. I also wear a sporran with my kilts. (I know we have some here who never wear them)

All that being said; with formal wear I try to stick to conventions out of respect for the host or occasion.