XKILT Question - Determining Under Apron/Pleat Width?

[panhandlephillips]

Forgive me if if this has been answered before, I did search the forums but could't find it.

How is the under apron and under apron pleat lenght determined in the XKILT? I'm using the instructions here http://www.geocities.com/alanhsails/X-Kilt_final2.pdf

I have read through the instructions a few times and can't seem to figure out where the numbers are coming from in appendix 1.

Thanks for the help!!

[Pleater]

I think that the appendix 1 layout is simply a typical arrangement of pleats and apron, just an example of the sort of combination to aim towards.

In the text there are the numbers of pleats and widths of aprons for various different sizes, and the 3 inch panels are simply a convenient size, which can be altered if necessary.

For the purposes of the description of making the kilt it was no doubt necessary to make some arbitary decisions about the size of the pleats, and so, once you have got your own measurements you can compare them with those suggested and then, if you wish make alterations to customise the arrangement for size and maybe shape so as to get the best effect for your efforts.

[panhandlephillips]

In the text there are the numbers of pleats and widths of aprons for various different sizes, and the 3 inch panels are simply a convenient size, which can be altered if necessary.

Th way I read this part is that this is the overapron width + #pleats(pleat width). Which makes sense.

What I am having trouble with is the underapron and underapron pleat dimensions. The numbers in the instructions seem to have been picked out of the blue.

[ccga3359]

Alan H on this forum designed the X-kilt. You could pm him directly with any questions. He's in California but does check in most nights. He also might be able to direct you to some of the more relevant threads as there have been many in regards to the X-Kilt one could accidentally skip over a good one.

[The F-H.C.A.G.]

Th way I read this part is that this is the overapron width + #pleats(pleat width). Which makes sense.

What I am having trouble with is the underapron and underapron pleat dimensions. The numbers in the instructions seem to have been picked out of the blue.

They are basically picked out of the blue. The appendix with the sample layout is from one of the first X-Kilts made. I would recommend at leat 4-6 inches more for the under apron than what you choose for an over apron width. This provides for decent modesty.

Be well,

[Pleater]

When I am making my kilts - which are, admittedly to a different style but the front is going to be the same - ish on all kilts, I make the aprons so they fall vertically when I sit down.

This is a combination of large under apron pleats and placing the edges of the apron in the centre of the thigh, so they slide down the inner curve rather than lie over the top.

This means that the area of pleats actually wraps around the hips - if you aproximate the shape to a box you have visible pleats right around three sides and over the edges of the fourth.

I always shape the left edge of the apron and the right edge of the inner apron by two inches - those are the edges within the kilt, but leave the ends straight. I make a two inch fold at the edge of the apron and press it so it tapers to nothing at the lower edge, because otherwise it looks as though the apron narrows.

Behind the shaping fold is the under apron pleat - usually I put all the leftover material into it, but it is nominally half the apron width, so there are six layers of fabric in the front of the kilt. That will allow you to move, even kick up your heels without too much danger of a can-can reveal.

(The early exponents of the can-can used to dance on tables with no drawers)

[Alan H]

I would suggest making the under-apron as wide as possible. Yeah, sure you can make it six-eight inches wide, kind of like a utilikilt, but why? The material is cheap. Make it 20 inches wide and opt for modesty. My own X-Kilt tht I wear has an under-apron that's the same width as my half-rump...that's 24 inches. That's just as wide as a traditional kilts under-apron.

As for "the under-apron pleat"...uhhh... there isn't an under-apron pleat!

The F-H.C.A.G. is right about how I came up with those numbers. Basically, I made a couple of kilts for friends, from scratch, and worked out the numbers. Then I wrote the first draft of the manual. When I made kilts 3 and 4, I revised the manual and that's what's up there. If you're good at geometry and a reasonable hand with a measuring tape and arithmatic....If you can visualize the overall shape of what a kilt would be, and you want to change those numbers, go right ahead. No law says a contemporary box-pleat kilt HAS to have 3 inch pleats. If you want 2 inch pleats, then pleat the thing up for 2 inches. There'll be more OF them, eh?

Maybe while I'm on my back after my upcoming surgery I'll re-edit the X-Kilt manual, since the same questions keep coming up over and over.

[Pleater]

No under apron pleats!?!



Buttons! Press studs!! Kilt liner!!! Underwear!!!!!

Er - re write with under apron pleats?

[Alan H]

No under apron pleats!?!



Buttons! Press studs!! Kilt liner!!! Underwear!!!!!

Er - re write with under apron pleats?

By this I mean that there's no pleating in the under-apron.

The over-apron has a deep reverse pleat underneath iy-, which then segues into a deep-ish pleat for pleat #1, over on the left side..OK, OK, my bad! this is called the "under-apron pleat"!

The under-apron begins at the last pleat on the right, and continues in one un-pleated length, as far across the body as the maker wants to do it. It lies beneath the over-apron, of course, when the wearer has it on. This is just like all the traditional kilts I've seen.

If someone just really wanted to add 10 inches to their under-apron and throw in a huge box-pleat that would "flop down" for modesty when sitting, I see no reason not to!

[fluter]

By this I mean that there's no pleating in the under-apron.

I just figured that out! Which answered one of my questions about the allocation for the under-apron. I think Tartan Hiker wrote that he puts any extra fabric into an under- under-apron pleat.

This is just like all the traditional kilts I've seen.

If someone just really wanted to add 10 inches to their under-apron and throw in a huge box-pleat that would "flop down" for modesty when sitting, I see no reason not to!

I don't have anything like a tank, but in a trad knife-pleat isn't a "reverse pleat" often put on the right-hand side of the under-apron? I may have the terms confused... deep pleat, reverse pleat. In effect this makes a reverse box-pleat with the last knife pleat, right?

My USAK semi-trad, SWK standard and heavyweight all have that reverse pleat. The Sport Kilt, SWK economy and thrifty do not. One thing I like about the SK is a very, very deep under-apron pleat. I suspect I'll be trying to maximize both of these under-pleats, at least to half the apron size as pleater suggests.