Checkered Kilt Hose Etiquette?

[M. A. C. Newsome]

Phil,

You are correct, the question was about etiquette, and the "recieved wisdom" for the recent past has been that diced or Argyle hose should be reserved for evening wear only (with some exceptions -- for example, Erskine's advice that they were acceptilbe daywear for liveried servants, or pipers).

Fashions change, however, so it is good to know not only what the current fashion etiquette rules are, but also why they are what they are, and whether or not things have been done differently in the past, or if the current trends are changing.

I think that diced and Argyle hose are becoming less and less popular these days than they were in the past, largely due to the increased cost. I get the sense from reading material from 50 or 100 years ago that diced or Argyle hose used to be much more common. It wasn't just that they were reserved for evening wear, but they were the only acceptible hose for evening wear. Solids were only for day wear.

These days solid colored hose are quite commonly seen with evening wear, which would have been anathema 100 years ago. So here we see fashion is changing, and the rules of etiquette along with it. I would suggest that fashion may allow for diced or Argyle hose to be worn more casually than perhaps was allowed in the past.

To be quite frank, being in the business I am in, I get to see quite a lot of plain colored solid knit hose, so I tend to applaud those who strike out and wear something different!

[gilmore]

While it is true that argyle hose is usually often expensive, Hawick Sock Company makes a fairly large range of it that go with many tartans, and at reasonable prices, often retailing at less that US$60. The problem is finding retailers who carry them. Or how to buy them directly from the manufacturer.

[Bugbear]

I might as well put a twist on this diced hose topic. Have any of you ever seen tweed hose?

[thescot]

Congrats on the new hose! You should kilt up and use it for your avatar!

Sister!

That'll be three Hail Marys and two Our Fathers.

Oh, wait a minute. You said, "kilt up," not "up yer kilt."

Never mind.

[Phil]

These days solid colored hose are quite commonly seen with evening wear, which would have been anathema 100 years ago. So here we see fashion is changing, and the rules of etiquette along with it. I would suggest that fashion may allow for diced or Argyle hose to be worn more casually than perhaps was allowed in the past.

To be quite frank, being in the business I am in, I get to see quite a lot of plain colored solid knit hose, so I tend to applaud those who strike out and wear something different!

I couldn't agree more, Matt. Every formal event I go to nowadays is full of men in PC's with white hose and it is so obvious most of them have hired the outfit. I can see the point of plain hose from a cost perspective and maybe that is why tartan hose have been kept for formal occasions. We Scots are supposed to be canny with the bawbees after all! As a teenager every formal event was a black tie occasion but then things changed, people couldn't be bothered and lounge suits became acceptable. Then, horror of horrors, tee shirts and jeans but all this time the women kept going to the hairdressers, slapping on the make-up and wearing their best frocks so what did that say about their menfolk? But then what goes around usually comes around and men are starting to get back to formal dressing again and it seems only right to follow some kind of etiquette so everyone is comfortable. What could be worse than turning up at some social event looking like a pantomime dame?

[McMurdo]

While it is true that argyle hose is usually often expensive, Hawick Sock Company makes a fairly large range of it that go with many tartans, and at reasonable prices, often retailing at less that US$60. The problem is finding retailers who carry them. Or how to buy them directly from the manufacturer.

Gilmore

Matt carries Hawick hose, so they really are not that hard to find, you just have to know where to look.

I recently reviewed some Hawick hose that I purchased from Redshanks Scotland, here is the link, so rest assured you can find Hawick hose if you look for them

[M. A. C. Newsome]

While it is true that argyle hose is usually often expensive, Hawick Sock Company makes a fairly large range of it that go with many tartans, and at reasonable prices, often retailing at less that US$60. The problem is finding retailers who carry them. Or how to buy them directly from the manufacturer.

Hawick Sock Company (real name is House of Cheviot) does make full Argyle hose, but absolutely not at $60 or less retail!

They make the Lewis hose we carry, which are solid color, and retail for $48. And this is about as low a retail price as we could sell them at and not lose our shirt on shipping costs, etc.

They also make the Balmoral hose we offer (which are a solid sock with a entralac top). These retail for $150, and again, that's about as low a retail price as we can offer these at (the tops are knit by hand).

We are, hopefully, in the new year going to begin offering diced and full argyle hose from them through our gift shop, and I anticipate the retail price being between $200 and $250, though I will try and keep that as low as I can. This is the same price range that you will find at most places, including Cuillin Craft, Highland Clans, Kenneth Short, and House of Tartan.

Note, I have not actually ordered argyle hose from the above companies, but I am providing links to their web sites for the purposes of price comparion. (Remember that the pound to dollar exchange rate is currently about 2:1). I know that Highland Clans carries other hose from House of Cheviot, so I would suspect that their argyle and diced hose come from them, as well, but I cannot confirm that. Kenneth Short is another hosiery firm in Hawick.

In short, unless you come across a real steal of a deal, you are not going to find an inexpensive pair of Argyll hose that is not also a cheap pair of hose. J. Higgins offers diced hose for $60. I have personally owned a pair of these and were not impressed with the quality. But you get what you pay for. If one needed diced hose and could not afford the price, these are a good alternative. But I wouldn't reccomend them as a matter of course. Higgins used to offer custom Argyle hose at about $75, I think, but I no longer see them listed on their web site. I've known two or three people who ordered them and none were happy with their purchase.

If someone were looking for a good deal on Argyle hose, House of Tartan has some listed on a sale page, for just over $100. These are pre-made, so you have to be happy with the colors and sizes that are available.

Then in my searching I came across this page offering custom hand knit argyll hose for $145. I have not done business with them, so I cannot speak of the quality, but if they are any good at all, that's a very good price for a pair of hand knit full tartan hose. If anyone has done business with them I'd like to hear what your impression of the socks was.

In short, argyle (full tartan) hose and diced hose are going to be expensive, no matter how you cut it, if you want any kind of quality at all. These are, for the most part, going to be custom ordered products, either machine knit in very small quantities, or hand knit to order. The upside is that if you buy from a reputable source, you will be getting a very fine quality product that will last a very long time -- and that's the real definition of "frugal!"

[James MacMillan]

The upside is that if you buy from a reputable source, you will be getting a very fine quality product that will last a very long time -- and that's the real definition of "frugal!"

Matt, I beg to differ, Frugal 1. Practicing or marked by economy, as in the expenditure of money or the use of material resources. See Synonyms at sparing.
2. Costing little; inexpensive: a frugal lunch.

Buying expensive things can never be called frugal. Wise? maybe. Smart? maybe. Regardless of the quality, a frugal person would never spend a lot of money on something he could do without.

[Phil]

This firm based in Ireland makes tartan and diced hose. I have not dealt with them but they have been on the go for a number of years and I believe they are reputable. The prices look about average so no real bargains there though.
http://www.kilkeelknitwear.com/new_page_26.htm

Kenneth Short I have dealt with and can recommend them. My hose (picture below) are theirs and I can vouch for the quality.

[Pleater]

So Sam Vimes' thoughts on boots are not current on the forum?

Samuel Vimes is the character on Discworld (a literary creation of Terry Pratchett) in charge of the city of Ankh Morpork Night Watch.

He points out that when a poor man needs boots he buys a pair for ten dollars, which begin to let in the water after a few months. In a year they are worn out and he has to buy another pair for another ten dollars.

When a rich man needs boots he buys a pair for fifty dollars which keep out the water and last a long time.

So, ten years down the line, the poor man has spent twice as much as the rich man on boots, and he still has wet feet.

I still have socks made from the yarn I knitted up when I was a teenager - I have learned to make better socks and so remade the old yarn into new socks, but the yarn had Nylon, was expensive by the standards of the time, but it is still good fourty years later.