Waistcoat with a belt

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

The other day, in the Kilt Advice Forum in a thread entitled "White Tie Detail Question, a picture of the Earl of Mansfield was posted, and he was wearing a belt over a formal waistcoat.

I did not particularly think the belt did anything for the Earl's appearance, but some of the gents pictured in this thread look good with a belt over a vest. I guess when it works it works, and when it doesn't it simply doesn't.

For me, the belt should not appear to be simply slapped on over top the vest as if the wearer felt compelled to wear a belt. The belt should look as if it was part of the outfit and be in harmony with the vest. Too many separate lines can confuse the eye and be distracting to the overall look.

Yes, in the photo of Lord Mansfield he is wearing a dirk belt over his waistcoat. He is also wearing a dirk, and is in the uniform of an officer of the Atholl Highlanders. I somehow rather doubt that Mansfield would show up at a formal event wearing a dirk and dirk belt if he wasn't in uniform...

[Paul]

Young Struan, chief of Clan Donnachaid, could use a few pointers from some of the old timers...that loose droopy belt he's wearing in this photo makes him look like an American tourist.

I'm positive that he was wearing a belt with his waistcoat at The Gathering. My girlfriend had a short conversation with him as he is technically her clan chief (not that she'd bothered by that!). He looked like he was dressed very well, too.

[CMcG]

I seem to recall seeing an old printing of the wonderful Thompson book, So You're Going to Wear the Kilt, and something struck me as odd, but at the same time very sharp. On the cover, it shows a gentleman in daywear, but instead of wearing a belt or waistcoat, he was wearing both with the waistcoat tucked into his kilt. My question is this, does anyone still do this? I fondly recall my late Grandfather doing this on occasion, & his Ancient Gordon looked wonderful with his charcoal jacket & waistcoat. Anyhoo, I've planned on experimenting with this look but I want some opinions on what you all think.

I'd advise against it. First, the waistcoat should never been tucked into the kilt; it just isn't designed (or intended) to do that. Secondly, when wearing a waistcoat the belt should be dispensed with as it presents an awkward appearance peeping out from under the waistcoat. Thirdly, the belt was/is intended to be worn with a dirk, and in those circumstances would be buckled over the waistcoat (as it is in the illustration on the cover of Thompson's book).

In the section of Thompson's book dealing with waistcoats and belts (third revised edition 1989, p 68-69), he advises on this very subject. If the two are worn together, he writes that the belt should go over top of the waistcoat and that the waistcoat should not be seen under the belt. His solution, if one were to have the problem of a waistcoat showing under the belt, is indeed to wear one's kilt over the waistcoat.

[CMcG]

<snip>
The thing to avoid, and the mistake that many people make, is wearing the belt underneath the waistcoat, which generally results in either the belt sticking half out from beneath the waistcoat, or creating an unsightly bulge in the waistcoat, or both.

Correct or not, I always wear a belt with my kilt and waistcoat.....But then again, I'll wear Argyll hose with my kilt and a t-shirt for a casual outing....

I, like NorCalPiper, like to wear a belt with my waistcoat, which I am now understanding to be "incorrect." I guess the cowboy in me just likes a big waist-plate! Luckily my waistcoat is four buttons with a lapel and is high waisted enough that my belt doesn't do that bulging or half-covered thing that Matt mentions.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

In the section of Thompson's book dealing with waistcoats and belts (third revised edition 1989, p 68-69), he advises on this very subject. If the two are worn together, he writes that the belt should go over top of the waistcoat and that the waistcoat should not be seen under the belt. His solution, if one were to have the problem of a waistcoat showing under the belt, is indeed to wear one's kilt over the waistcoat.

Life is full of bad "solutions" to what should be non-existant problems. If one followed Thompson's suggestion to its (il)logical conclusion, one would suppose he'd advise Texas businessmen to tuck their waistcoats into their suit trousers so people could see their rodeo belt buckles. Sorry, but as this is the "Traditional" forum, I'm sticking to my guns with a very traditional comment:

Kilted, or in trousers, one should never "tuck in" his waistcoat.

[CMcG]

By citing Thompson on this subject, I didn't mean to imply that he was correct. The OP mentioned an image from the book of the "waistcoat tucked in belt over top" look and the point I wanted to make was that the author covered it in the text as well.

I wouldn't do it, but according to Thompson and in response to the OP, there are people who do.

[Highlander31]

This is not a bad look, but the military in me would like to fix his gig line. ith:

That was my first thought as well.

Life is full of bad "solutions" to what should be non-existant problems. If one followed Thompson's suggestion to its (il)logical conclusion, one would suppose he'd advise Texas businessmen to tuck their waistcoats into their suit trousers so people could see their rodeo belt buckles. Sorry, but as this is the "Traditional" forum, I'm sticking to my guns with a very traditional comment:

Kilted, or in trousers, one should never "tuck in" his waistcoat.

I agree. I can't imagine tucking the waistcoat into my kilt, or the vest into my trousers (back when I was required to wear three piece suits.)

[Heming]

Kilted, or in trousers, one should never "tuck in" his waistcoat.

Hear! Hear!

[Paul]

I just found this picture. The Duke of Argyll wore a belt and waistcoat on his wedding day:

[MacAngus]

Look at pics of john D. Burgess anything he wore wouldn't be wrong.
I often wear a red waistcoat tucked into the kilt with my belt over it .
It looks great if the top of the buckle is even with the top of the kilt