Missed opportunity to speak of TITLES

[M. A. C. Newsome]

This is my first, and perhaps only post concerning the removal and/or restoration of titles. I never really paid much attention to them when we had them, and didn't even notice when they were removed until people started discussing it. So count me in that camp that doesn't really care one way or the other.

But it has occurred to me reading the posts in this and other threads, that people either post to say how much they miss the titles and hope they come back, or they post to say that (like me) they never really paid attention to them so it doesn't really matter.

I have yet to see a post by someone who adamantly feels that they should not come back and have no place in the forum.

I think that fact alone may be telling....

[longhuntr74]

I have yet to see a post by someone who adamantly feels that they should not come back and have no place in the forum.

I think that fact alone may be telling....

Add me to this camp! I sometimes noted them, most times not. I can't say that there presence or absence has a profound impact on my life, but I would like to see them returned...because, as many others have said, they add some fun to the forum, give a goal for some to achieve, and do recognize peoples contributions (more or less).

I disagree with those that say they are "exclusionary"...the only qualification to achieve one is time spent and contribution to the community...and isn't that what the forum is about and what makes it a great place to visit? Everybody can achieve one if they do what others have done to achieve theirs.

[ForresterModern]

This is my first, and perhaps only post concerning the removal and/or restoration of titles. I never really paid much attention to them when we had them, and didn't even notice when they were removed until people started discussing it. So count me in that camp that doesn't really care one way or the other.

But it has occurred to me reading the posts in this and other threads, that people either post to say how much they miss the titles and hope they come back, or they post to say that (like me) they never really paid attention to them so it doesn't really matter.

I have yet to see a post by someone who adamantly feels that they should not come back and have no place in the forum.

I think that fact alone may be telling....

Matt has a great point here I think. The original premise for removing the special titles and post count related rankings, all of which meant little REAL effect in the grand scheme of things, was that they were potentially intimidating to new members and had little relevance to the value of that persons posts and contribution to the forum. As Matt has astutely noted, instead of three camps in this debate--those of those in favor of the titles, those against the titles for some particular REAL (not imagined) reason, and those who couldn't give a rip either way---we seem to be hearing only the voices of those in the first and thrid camps, and no REAL valid argumants for why the special titles and ranking should NOT be a part of the forum again.

I for one, when I arrived, and to a degree still, valued the notoriety of those with special titles, even silly and meaningless as, say, grand defender of the rubber chicken, as they were unofficially earned recognition of some particular contribution to the forum, be that based on knowledge, service, or simply a major contribution to the overall tenor and tone of the forum family atmosphere. The ranking, faulted as they were by potentially inflated numbers due to low utility posts like "nice kilt" and "way to go", still, when combined with the recognition of how long the poster had been a member here, and with the reading of just a few of that member's posts, fairly quickly could tell the newbie who really had a valued voice and opinion in this forum, regardless of who often they posted. And over time those with lesser numbers of posts, but a long duration here, also came to be recognized as being knowledgeable, but selective in their choice of what to say and when, such as Mac o Rath, just as an example.

But the point overall is that where was the hue and cry to rid the forum of these achievement points actually coming from, the populace in general, the newbies (I for one never as a newbie complained about intimidation by either the numbers or titles), or the admins for fear of scaring of newcomers (something I am not sure has ever been demonstrated to be a valid concern with any case demonstration or data).

I like Grant, Jock, and the many others here miss them, and the whimsical jocularity that they brought with them to this extended kilted family we call a forum, and long for those "olden days" of yore.

I even see that Grant has changed his avatar to a black swatch, a symbol of his mourning for their loss, perhaps?

Again, just one man's O.

jeff

[Bugbear]

Matt has a great point here I think. The original premise for removing the special titles and post count related rankings, all of which meant little REAL effect in the grand scheme of things, was that they were potentially intimidating to new members and had little relevance to the value of that persons posts and contribution to the forum. As Matt has astutely noted, instead of three camps in this debate--those of those in favor of the titles, those against the titles for some particular REAL (not imagined) reason, and those who couldn't give a rip either way---we seem to be hearing only the voices of those in the first and thrid camps, and no REAL valid argumants for why the special titles and ranking should NOT be a part of the forum again.

I for one, when I arrived, and to a degree still, valued the notoriety of those with special titles, even silly and meaningless as, say, grand defender of the rubber chicken, as they were unofficially earned recognition of some particular contribution to the forum, be that based on knowledge, service, or simply a major contribution to the overall tenor and tone of the forum family atmosphere. The ranking, faulted as they were by potentially inflated numbers due to low utility posts like "nice kilt" and "way to go", still, when combined with the recognition of how long the poster had been a member here, and with the reading of just a few of that member's posts, fairly quickly could tell the newbie who really had a valued voice and opinion in this forum, regardless of who often they posted. And over time those with lesser numbers of posts, but a long duration here, also came to be recognized as being knowledgeable, but selective in their choice of what to say and when, such as Mac o Rath, just as an example.

But the point overall is that where was the hue and cry to rid the forum of these achievement points actually coming from, the populace in general, the newbies (I for one never as a newbie complained about intimidation by either the numbers or titles), or the admins for fear of scaring of newcomers (something I am not sure has ever been demonstrated to be a valid concern with any case demonstration or data).

I like Grant, Jock, and the many others here miss them, and the whimsical jocularity that they brought with them to this extended kilted family we call a forum, and long for those "olden days" of yore.

I even see that Grant has changed his avatar to a black swatch, a symbol of his mourning for their loss, perhaps?

Again, just one man's O.

jeff

There are members who have stated that they perceive other members as posting to drive up their rank etc.

Removing the rank and post count would remove that complaint issue; though I suppose it would not fully remove the perception.

I guess at this point, for me, it really doesn't matter; the perception of others would still linger...

I think this all has to do with people, through their posts, rubbing other people the wrong way, and very little to do with titles and ranks.

[robthehiker]

There are members who have stated that they perceive other members as posting to drive up their rank etc.

Do they feel that XMarks would be a better place without people driving up their post count by saying things like "welcome" and "happy birthday" and "sorry to hear you're not well"? Interesting.

[Bugbear]

Do they feel that XMarks would be a better place without people driving up their post count by saying things like "welcome" and "happy birthday" and "sorry to hear you're not well"? Interesting.

I don't know.

However, except for one very weird birthday thread, I have been avoiding posting in those threads.

Like I said, I am beginning to feel that this has very little to do with the counts and titles, rather an underlying issue of guessing why other people are posting: intentions etc.

And with that, I should probably drop out of this thread.

[MacLowlife]

OK, so I have posted on a related topic before. Having followed this thread and having great respect for many of its contributors, I would like to add one point that may not have occurred to most of us. Just as Matt observed that almost nobody has said they OBJECT to the titles, which slipped past me before, I have only recently noticed what might be the most significant phenomenon of all.

I speak of the enthusiastic newcomer phenomenon, the condition where you can't turn around without seeing some lowlife's opinion on just about everything. I have been that lowlife. Maybe this post shows that I haven't entirely escaped my enthusiastic past. But, when I see a person with a high post count whose work I haven't previously noticed, I do two or three things:
1) I consider the quality of his/ her posts- do they seem well reasoned, or at least reasonable? Do they seem to be in the spirit of this special place? Are they occasionally humble, or at least willing to consider another's point of view?
2) I check the longevity-to-output ratio as well as the post count.
3) I go back and see what contributions this person may have made before I noticed.

I might add, I try to see how my fellow X Markers regard this person and how frequently this person's posts stimulate useful conversation and exchange of ideas. And I like to follow how friendly this person is in exchanges.

Titles and post counts don't necessarily give a full picture of a person's worth. I think we all agree on that. But, if nothing else, they give a hint now and then that a person has some street cred and they invite the newcomer, enthusiastic or shy, to investigate further.

Cordially ( and almost humbly)
M'll